29 July 2025

16 minutes

Available for over a year

In this episode, Chris and Xand continue to explore the power of saying 'no', this time focussing on defiance in parenting and childhood. They’re joined by behavioural scientist and physician Dr Sunita Sah from Cornell Univeristy.

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Presenters: Drs Chris and Xand van Tulleken

Guest: Dr Sunita Sah

Producer: Emily Bird

Executive Producers: Rami Tzabar and Jo Rowntree

Editor: Kirsten Lass

Assistant Producer: Maia Miller-Lewis

Tech Lead: Reuben Huxtable

Social Media: Leon Gower

Digital Lead: Richard Berry

Composer: Phoebe McFarlane

Sound Design: Melvin Rickarby

At the BBC:

Assistant Commissioner: Greg Smith

Commissioning Editor: Rhian Roberts

A Loftus Media production for BBC Radio 4.