A Paralympics Special

Downloaded from www.bbc.co.uk/radio4

THE ATTACHED TRANSCRIPT WAS TYPED FROM A RECORDING AND NOT COPIED FROM AN ORIGINAL SCRIPT. BECAUSE OF THE RISK OF MISHEARING AND THE DIFFICULTY IN SOME CASES OF IDENTIFYING INDIVIDUAL SPEAKERS, THE BBC CANNOT VOUCH FOR ITS COMPLETE ACCURACY.

IN TOUCH – A Paralympics Special

TX: 29.12.2020 2040-2100

PRESENTER: PETER WHITE

PRODUCER: MIKE YOUNG

White

Good evening. Tonight, we look back at the 2020 Paralympics that never were and forwards to the Games that we all hope we’ll see in the year to come. The Tokyo Games, of course, postponed for a year because of the pandemic are now planned for late August and early September 2021. But what impact has all of this delay and rescheduling had on the athletes themselves and the Games’ organisers and will the Games really go ahead next year? Which I think is the thing that we don’t want to contemplate a problem there.

Tonight, we’re going to be hearing from visually impaired Paralympians and some of the people hoping to get the Tokyo show back on the road next summer. Paralympics GB’s Chef de Mission is Penny Briscoe and Penny, you were in Tokyo, I think, literally just before lockdown started in March. I mean how was it looking then and did you sense the 2020 Games were really at risk at that point?

Briscoe

We were actually trying to complete our – what we thought – was going to be our final recce ahead of the Games, obviously later in the summer. When we there in March, the venues were looking spectacular, the village was looking amazing and Tokyo were very much on track to deliver the Games in the summer of 2020. The Games being cancelled was the right decision, absolutely. Ultimately, health and wellbeing had to be put first. So, I think it was warmly applauded in terms of the decision by athletes and national Paralympic committees around the world as the right thing to do.

White

And how have you looked after the many athletes in the team – you know, the disappointment, the impact on their training and their funding will all have been considerable – I’m just wondering how you’ve handled the last 10 months or so?

Briscoe

You know, we had to stop, take breath and say, okay, what does this mean? And there were quite significant implications, both sort of financially and operationally. So, we moved quickly and decisively, made some tough decisions and just tried to lock down the things that we could control. The national governing bodies, who were obviously responsible for the preparation of the athletes, also moved really quickly, in the springtime, and made sure that athletes were in their home bases, the priority was health and wellbeing, both of the athletes and their families and those that were able, or wanted to train, the national governing bodies ensured that they – you know, pop-up home-based training bases sort of occurred everywhere. And the athlete experience was quite different, depending on personal circumstances but also dependent on the sport. So, it was easier for some of the athletes in triathlon or para-canoe to actually get out because they’re outdoor sports whereas team-based sports, indoor sports, found some of the return to training protocols quite challenging.

White

And presumably, the difficulty must be that, as you say, it means different things to different people, some people will have been at their peak at that point and may not be now, some people the other way round and presumably, you have to reselect the team from scratch to some extent?

Briscoe

The selection policies are the domain of the national governing bodies and as a British Paralympic Association we hadn’t actually selected any athletes in March. On a really positive note, we’ll be moving into 2021 and in January announcing the first athletes on the team sheet.

White

Right, well let’s hear a little from individuals. Chris Skelley – Chris is aiming for Paralympic success in judo, a sport, of course, in which historically GB visually impaired competitors have done particularly well. Now Chris is in the under-100 kilo category, that’s one of the heaviest divisions, he’s training in Holland right now, so, we caught up with him in advance a bit earlier for a chat and to see how that training is going.

Skelley

I competed in Rio in 2016 and it was one of the best experiences of my life, the best experience. I can’t tell you what it feels like to have – well it must have been about 9,000 Brazilians booing you when you’re going to step out onto the judo mat and it was the most scary but best feeling. I’ve never really competed in front of a crowd because visually impaired judo don’t get much kind of crowds to the competition, so it was a really, really special moment. Sadly, I didn’t get a medal but I’ve got two world medals since then and in the last year became world number one. It’s been quite a rollercoaster few years. I’m really looking forward to the Paralympics in 2021. Here is a taster, in my training session, with my coach.

Actuality – training session

Go on then Chris. Nice. Nice, I like that.

Johns

My name’s Ian Johns and I am the Paralympic head coach for GB. My job is to ensure that we get fighters from grass roots all the way through to Paralympic podiums.

Actuality – training session

Right, go on then, go again. So, I was just saying there Skel about how Harry was fighting you and very much like the Russian boys you’re going to have to face if you go to the Games. What was so Russian about him?

He’s tall, he’s lengthy switches. So, the Russian boy switches quite a bit. And he’s got long limbs, so you’re think you’re safe but you’re not.

Going on then, you’ve got your grip, go, go, go.

What was you doing to counter his right high grip?

Either, to counter his right high grip, I’d have to control the shoulder, his right shoulder and on your terms you can engage him.

Go on then, go again.

Johns

So Skelley is currently working on how to throw big. He is world class in ground fighting, at the minute, which is the two parts of judo. He’s really trying to work hard on how to throw people.

Nice, go on, go on, go on.

Been working on this really hard as well, so hopefully that’ll be the final ingredient to take him from Paralympic medallist to Paralympic champion. Let’s see eh.

Skelley

When it originally got announced that it was being postponed obviously, I think, a lot of us was quite upset. Really it was a blessing in disguise and it’s given me a whole year to get a little bit stronger in the areas that I need to get stronger in. Yes, it’s been postponed but I’ve got another year to get better.

White

Which only goes to show that blessings can come in some pretty strange disguises. Our thanks to Chris Skelley and his coach Ian Johns.

Well, also, joining us today is one of the – probably the best known visually impaired athletes of all, runner Libby Clegg, who has silver medals from the Beijing and London Games and golds from Rio in the T11 100 metres and 200 metres. Here’s a little of the atmosphere from the London Games in 2012 when Libby appeared on In Touch back then.

Clip – London Games 2012

I’m really proud of myself, I think we gave – you know – it was a tough race, we gave the best performance we possibly could and we came away with the silver. The Chinese were absolutely incredible and they’ve been a fantastic competitor and I hope to have – see them again next year at the world championships.

Does that bring it all back Libby?

Clegg

It does. What you actually wouldn’t have known after that is I literally walked back to the warm up track crying my eyes out because I was absolutely devastated that I’d just missed out on the gold and I don’t think it really hit me until I started to get my kit back on. I went back, obviously, after that and worked on a few things and changed and tweaked a bit of my training and, yeah, obviously then going into Rio in 2016 I was very successful.

White

Very successful. Tell me, what did you make of what Chris Skelley was saying to us, Libby, you know, he’s rather grateful for having had a year’s delay with the 2020 Games now in 2021, to get him better and stronger, as he put it, how has that worked for you?

Clegg

To be honest, I was planning on winding it down a bit and hopefully retiring from athletics obviously in September just gone, so I was actually pretty gutted. Also, I’d done a lot of work, I’d been on Dancing on Ice, I was definitely in the best shape I’d been in, in a long time and I was hoping to continue that on into my athletics season, so I was absolutely devastated. And also, I was wanting to spend more time with my son.

White

Because your son is still pretty small isn’t he, he’s only a baby.

Clegg

He’s only a baby, he’s about 20 months old now, so, yeah, he’s still quite young.

White

In 2020 you weren’t able to train, I think, alongside your guide runner – Chris Clark – for much of the time because of social distancing, so, I guess that’s another reason why, in a way, this may be could work out, we hope, better.

Clegg

Definitely, most of my training is done with my guide runner, Chris, so, especially with the social distancing not being able to even run alongside one another, meant that I wasn’t able to work to the best of my ability in my training sessions. So, for me, having an extra year now really beneficial going into next year. It means we’ll have better competition prep and that kind of thing. So, it would have been a rush if we’d tried to compete this year, so I’m very grateful that we don’t have to do that.

White

So, you said, in a way, you were thinking of 2020 being your last, will ’21 be your last Games, at least as a runner?

Clegg

I’m pretty sure I’m going to call it a day in September from athletics. I feel like I’ve given a lot of my life to it and I feel like I’m ready for something new, a different challenge, so we’ll see. It might not be the last of me but more than likely on the track.

White

Right, so this is a hint you’re thinking of maybe another sport, which happens quite a lot in Paralympics, doesn’t it, can you give us any clue of what you might be considering?

Clegg

I’d definitely like to have a go at track cycling, I think I’d transfer reasonably well but who knows, I’ve never done it before. So, I’d like to have a go at it and see if it’s something that I’d be interested in doing and try a sport that potentially has a little less impact on my ageing body.

White

I think we may hear a bit more about ageing bodies as time goes on but is that because, in a way, I mean, the Paralympics is very special to people, is it that you just don’t want to give it up?

Clegg

From the very first Games that I went to in 2008, in Beijing, I got an absolute buzz from competing in front of 80-90,000 people. You chase that high for every four years and that’s what I love about it, it’s the atmosphere, it’s the sense of being a part of a massive team and just there’s so many incredible and inspirational people, it’s fantastic just being in that environment.

White

Well, before we let you go Libby, your partner, Dan, Dan Powell, is also visually impaired and is in the GB Paralympic judo team, so it would be very rude not to hear from him as well. Dan, the Tokyo Games were supposed to be a really family affair then for you both.

Powell

Yeah, definitely, I was massively gearing up for the Games, I was counting down the Monday mornings that I had to get up and put me body through hell, you know, doing such a high impact sport like judo. I’m approaching 30 now but some days, especially when it gets to a Friday, after a heavy week’s training, I wake up and I feel double that age at least.

White

So, you and Libby, you’ve both got ageing bodies then?

Powell

Yeah and our little boy…

White

That’s not very chivalrous of me is it really?

Powell

Well, you know, as you say, and Libby says, we’ve got our little boy as well, he’s 20 months old and he is keeping us on our toes and he’s been me only little training partner over the last six to 10 months. He’s getting a bit big now, I think he’ll have me in the next year, so we need to get this Games out the way.

White

Can I just ask you – why is judo such a good sport for visually impaired people, do you think?

Powell

Especially for visually people – it’s probably the closest sport in terms of its mainstream counterpart. The only difference is the fact that you start a lot closer together instead of separated, like you do in the mainstream game. And I think that’s why there’s such a high amount of talent that crosses over from mainstream level to Para-side as well. In our country, me and the lads we fight nationally on the mainstream side of things, just to get that quality that we wouldn’t get if we’re constantly fighting at visually impaired level.

White

Medal chances? I mean are you going to match Libby’s two golds, that she’s obviously going to get?

Powell

Got a bit of catching up to do, haven’t I? I’ve done a bit of a clear out of a load of stuff, load of old memory boxes and stuff and I came across my seventh place from London 2012 and I said to Libby – I can’t put that on the wall next to your two gold medals, can I? So, I need to pull something out of the bag, I’d love to cap my judo career off with a nice shiny thing around my neck, so that would be lovely.

White

Yeah, you’ll have to get a bigger wall the two of you. But Dan and Libby, thank you very much for joining us on this. I just want to go back to Penny Briscoe briefly. Penny, you’re Paralympic Chef de Mission, what do you make of all that – the passion is there from the athletes – can the Tokyo Games be made to work do you think?

Briscoe

Absolutely. I think there’s a huge amount of excitement in terms of the Games in Tokyo. Andrew Parsons, the Chair of IPC, talks about a celebration of the resilience of humanity and the Governor of Tokyo is certainly saying Tokyo will be a Games of hope. I think from our perspective, we’re really looking forward, the conditions need to be right in terms of the sort of covid secure environment, which the organising committee – the IOC, IPC – have been working on. And I think the points that have been made by the athletes today, are quite right, that “ready plus” is one of the mottos, we’ve had an extra year to prepare and our ambition is to be best prepared and I think that in 2021 we’ll be taking a very strong team to Tokyo. We have medal potential throughout the sports and we’ll be looking to recreate some of the medal success from Rio but also to celebrate Para sport at its best.

White

I just want to end with someone who perhaps has almost done everything in Paralympic sport – Tim Reddish, winner of numerous swimming medals in three Paralympics and now a member of the International Paralympic Committee governing body. Tim, we chatted in the summer and I know that you’ve been to Tokyo and I know you were really impressed with the level of preparation that there was, particularly the access that they were providing.

Reddish

They are and they’re focusing on a lot of different things. And just to hopefully, if you don’t mind – well, first of all, you’ve come to me because I’m the aged one, I’m the oldest but I did go for a swim this morning everybody, by the way. But anyway…

White

You were in the Athens one weren’t you, the original one in 96 BC or…

Reddish

Yeah, that’s the one, yeah. Anyway, so realistically – what we’ve got to think about is that the IPC and the organising committees they’re absolutely fantastic at organising Games but the Paralympic Games give an opportunity for Games plus. And there are a lot of things that we can try to influence and one of them you spoke about is accessibility and accessibility comes in all sorts of shapes and forms. They’re trying to get things as best they can because their hotels aren’t best, let’s be honest, and they’ve looked to that but they’ve put in laws in place that obviously through universal design in the future, it will be better. And one of the challenges that obviously the postponement’s put in place is that we’re trying to make the Games more cost effective, so that it can be more diverse for different nations around the world but because of the pandemic, the cost has now gone up again. And that’s a challenge.

White

Do you envisage a smaller scale Games than was originally planned? I mean, let’s face it, some Paralympic athletes who’ve got serious health conditions, for example, may still not be able to get there, as spectator numbers may still have to be reduced, are these things that are all going to have to be thought about?

Reddish

Yeah and the working through all those things. And people are asking can we be told this now but the thing that we’re worried about is giving people part information. So, for example, I said earlier about we’re very, very good and organising committees are exceptionally good at running Games. Now they’ve got to become the world’s expert in infection prevention with a pandemic. So, that’s the overlay on top. So, think about when you have the Games you normally might have a volunteer cleaner come in a couple of times a week, well all those things change now because of the pandemic and everything else. And also, crowds – we’re learning from all different sports. So, we don’t know for definite yet, because we’re still waiting for Tokyo to confirm, but it is likely – and this is me saying this, there’s no guarantees here – that the crowds will be smaller. I don’t think we need to worry about the numbers, I think the one thing that will be absolutely spot on will be the enthusiasm of the people from Japan and those that do travel. And we’ve got to be mindful of their health and wellbeing.

White

In your bones, do you think that this Games is going to take place okay?

Reddish

Yes, yeah. It won’t be for the want of not trying to put everything in place because if you think of the culture of Tokyo and Japan and Asia, they want to do it right and they will do everything they can to make it happen. And the IOC have been absolutely fantastic around this, they may not have worked as quick as some of the athletes would like and some of the federations, like the BPA, but they won’t leave anything to chance, they’ll put everything in place.

White

Tim Reddish, thank you very much for ending on an optimistic note. And also, my thanks to Penny Briscoe, to Libby Clegg, Dan Powell, Chris Skelley and his trainer Tim [sic] Johns. Here’s hoping it will be a successful and covid-free Paralympics beckoning in 2021. And we’re planning on reporting it for you on In Touch of course.

Our email is [email protected], if you’d like to drop us a line and we’ll look forward to being with you once again in the new year. From me, Peter White, my producer, Mike Young, all our guests and studio manager, Owyn Williams, goodbye.