TWENTY20 INTERNATIONAL, BRIT OVAL:
West Indies 208-8 (20 overs) v England 193-7 (20 overs)
A superb Paul Collingwood innings on his England captaincy debut proved all in vain as West Indies won the first Twenty20 International at The Oval.
The tourists left the sour memories of the Test series far behind as they smashed 208-8, aided by some naive bowling from a seam-dominated attack.
Devon Smith hit 61 off 34 balls, Marlon Samuels adding a brash 51 off just 26.
Collingwood finished with 79 off 41 balls but was run out in the last over and England ended on 193-7.
LATEST ACTION AS IT HAPPENED (ALL TIMES BST)
ENGLAND INNINGS
20th over - WICKET: Collingwood run out 79, Eng 192-7 Bravo is going to bowl the final over. One for Yardy with a drive to long-off before Colly picks up a risky, but necessary, two. The fielder threw to the wrong end - Yardy would have been toast. England need 20 from four...Colly can only hoick Bravo to leg and the Windies have this one in the bag. Yardy runs one on a Ramdin fumble and Collingwood grabs two more with a slap through mid-off...no he doesn't, the third umps says that's a run out...great knock from the England skipper. Broad needs 17 from one ball - go on son, you can do it...ooooh, no he can't, he can only manage one from the final ball and that's a fine win for a rejuvenated Windies outfit. Sir Viv reckons Brixton will be going wild. I think he thinks it's 1976 - it's all football, football, football nowadays, Sir Vivian... 19th over - Eng 186-6 Yardy picks up a couple of couples, although he should have been run out by Ramdin, but England pick up an overthrow instead. A rare dot ball from Rampaul, beating Yardy outside the off-stump. Yardy drabs Rampaul away for a single and England need 25 from eight - a couple of boundaries are required, and now...instead, Colly swings and misses...two from Colly from the final ball and England need 23 from the last over - it's been done ladies and gents...
"I'm reminded of the John Cleese line in Clockwise, which sadly I can't now quote properly, but goes something like 'it's not the despair. I can live with the despair - it's the hope...'"
Sarah, Canterbury, in the TMS inbox
18th over - Eng 179-6 Yardy, who up until that point had been kicking his heels in the kitchen with a tube of Pringles, joins the party in a big way, clumping Powell straight down the ground for four before dragging Powell away for four in front of square. A pair of singles for Yardy and Colly before Yardy slices one down to third-man, where Chanderpaul saves four. Tap-tap-tapparoo from Collingwood, getting his left leg out of the way and smashing Powell straight down the ground for four. England still swinging - as Sir Vivian has just said on TMS, the ball must be crying today. In fact, I reckon it will need a facemask, a vigorous massage and a week in St Tropez after this game's over.
17th over - Eng 164-6 Colly almost perishes, carting Sammy over wide long-on, but Powell shells the catch. Collingwood runs two and should be out next ball - not according to umpire Llong, though, who decides it was missing...I'm not sure what he thought it was missing to be honest. Colly slams another four over wide long-on and follows up with a flipped six over deep square-leg. Colly playing a magnificent captain's knock, give that man an MBE...
16th over - Eng 149-6 Colly picks up six over long-off before reverse sweeping Samuels round the corner for four. Colingwood is ramming my stupid, stupid words down my stupid-stupid throat before stamping on my neck with his boot - another six, a huge one over wide long-on - 20 from the over, that's the England skipper's fifty. England still alive, they need 60 from 24 balls. 15th over - Eng 129-6 Yardy doesn't quite time a pull off Sammy, but he gets one for it. Colly picks up a couple with a push into the off-side before Yardy picks up a single with a flay down the ground. England need some muscle, and I'm not sure this pair are man enough. Two more from Colly with a square-drive and there are eight from the over.
"Would KP's mole (see below) have thick glasses and a miner's lamp? He might be able to offer advice on the light, whilst perched on his helmet."
Marcus, Londinium, in the TMS inbox
14th over - Eng 121-6 Sweet as a nut from Colly, chipping Samuels over long-on for six. Colly gets in a right old pickle, attempting a reverse sweep and the ball deflecting off his calf and racing away for four. Yardy picks up one with what can only be descibed as a reverse paddle before Colly grabs a couple with a dabble through fine-leg. We need humpty, Colly, HUMPTY!
13th over - WICKET: Mascarenhas c Morton b Sammy 2, Eng 101-6
That's the game up for England, Mascarenhas making room and plopping the ball into Morton's hands at gully. Colly can't find the gaps - he picks up Sammy cleanly but the ball is fielded at square-leg and he can only run one. 12th over - Eng 100-5 Now is the time for inspiration and Colly reverse pulls Samuels for four. A wide from Samuels before Colly brings up England's ton with a nudge into the on-side. England need more than nudge and nurdle, England need crash, bang, wallop what a picture...
"Being more pedantic than Seymour Skinner, I can't help but notice that it wasn't John Lennon who complained of blisterated digits. It was instead mr Ringo Starr, as confirmed by Wikipedia. Pedants of the world unite, we shall annoy the world forever!"
Tim Hiley in the TMS inbox
11th over - WICKET: Shah lbw b Smith 7, Eng 90-5 West Indies are revitalised - this is not the same side that was flogged in the Test series. Shah and Colly exchange a couple of singles apiece before Smith picks up the wicket of Shah, the Middlesex batsman swishing across the line, missing and finding himself on the wrong end of a leg before decision. England's challenge is fading... "What sort of captain is Chris Gayle - a shouter, a teacup thrower?"
Phil Tufnell on TMS
10th over - WICKET: Pietersen run out 16, Eng 78-4
The Big Man's gone, Dwayne Smith fielding on the point boundary, delivering a perfect throw and Ramdin whipping off the stumps with KP diving full stretch. Initially, KP is rolling about like a drunk who's just taking a kicking at a bus stop, but he does manage to walk off the pitch unaided. Shah is off the mark with a glide down to the third-man boundary for four. 9th over - Eng 78-3 The tourists appear to have saved all their best fielding moves for the shorter forms of the game - Sammy there with a sprawling save to limit KP to a couple. KP picks up a single with a push to long-on before Colly is off the mark with a chip over mid-wicket for four.
"Ben, was my last email not as witty or are you only allowing (bouncer-esque) one email a match? If so, shall I pop off and do the washing up (while watching the cricket, of course)?"
Sarah, Canterbury, in the TMS inbox
8th over - WICKET: Trott b Sammy 9, Eng 69-3 Trott picks up a single with a push down the ground before KP cuts loose, lacing Sammy through the covers for four and following up with some Hammer Time to the wide long-on boundary. But that's Trott gone, the Warwickshire batsman missing a straight one and losing his off-stump. Sammy launches into a little penguin dance, and do I like that! Collingwood is the new man, and England need their skipper to play a manful innings. 7th over - Eng 59-2 Trott picks up two more into the leg-side before Pietersen is very nearly cleaned up by Smith, the Hampshire man making room and looking to take a liberty. Pietersen picks up a single from the final ball of the over and someone is going to have to put pedal to metal here, this is drifting away from England. As the great John Lennon once opined, "I've got blisters on my fingers!"
6th over - Eng 54-2 There is something vaguely foppish about Pietersen. I half expect him to emerge from the pavilion wearing a powdered wig, stick-on mole and twirling a cane. He's off the mark with a single into the off-side and Trott follows suit, playing an unconvincing flick to square-leg for a couple. Two more for Trott into the same area and he picks up another couple with a similar shot. I take it from that over that Trott likes the nurdle to square-leg...
"'Prior really is a meaty little cricketer'. Are we talking Pepperami, Melton Mowbray Pork Pie or something entirely different? By the way, my colleagues here in Brazil marvel at the sheer 'unprofessionalism' of your commentary. To that I give them sort of smile not seen since the Imperial days...Rule Britannia."
Seb, S�o Paulo, in the TMS inbox
5th over - WICKET: Prior c Powell b Smith 25
That's Prior gone I'm afraid, the Sussex gloveman sticking Smith down Powell's throat at long-on. Here comes KP. 5th over - WICKET: Cook c Bravo b Smith 15
Dwayne Smith is into the attack for Powell and he gets rid of Cookie, the Essex man making room and skewing Smith to Bravo at backward-point. I can't help thinking that could be a blessing in disguise for England, I'm not sure Cook's cut out for this hit and giggle stuff. New man Trott is the new batsman. Prior picks up a couple with a heave down the ground before picking Smith up and depositing him over the square-leg fence for six. 4th over - Eng 39-0 Smart fielding from Samuels at extra-cover, preventing a Cook four. Cook carves Rampaul over cover for one before Prior frees himself up and swings the bowler through the off-side for four. Huge leg before shout against Prior, but umpire Hartley decides the batsman has advanced too far down the pitch. Cook picks up a couple with a nudge through point.
"Adam, does that make Pro40 a long snog? Or one of those holiday romances where you run off a day early and hide in case she tries to get your address?"
Glyn in the TMS inbox
3rd over - Eng 31-0 Better from Cook, carving Powell over extra-cover for four. "We Will Rock You" is cranked up on the loudspeakers - Tony Cozier, somewhat surprisingly, is a Queen fan. Prior goes macho, slapping Powell to the long-off fence before launching a dirty great Big Bertha over Cow Corner for six. Prior really is a meaty little cricketer.
2nd over - Eng 15-0 Rampaul to share the new ball and he gets one past an airy waft from Cook. Cook swings Rampaul away for a couple, and he's not timing it yet - Tuffers in the TMS commentary box reckons he's batting with a chair leg. Cook does picks up his first boundary, rocking back and heaving Rampaul over the imaginary slip cordon. Just six from the over, decent start from Rampaul.
1st over - Eng 9-0 Players are out are England have their work cut out here - and unless they get their fingers out, I'll be 10 squid lighter by the close of play. Big lbw shout by Powell against Cook, but the umpire's having none of it. But that's the first boundary of the innings, Powell serving up a wild bumper that misses Prior, evades Ramdin and races away to the fine-leg fence. Prior is off the mark with a single and Cook nurdles (you don't here that a lot in Twenty20 commentary) into the on-side for a single. Nine from the first over.
"We should be able to get this, although if we'd have gone for more Twenty20 specialists then it would be easier. Hopefully Prior and Peiterson can get stuck in with the new boys, and we get a second win."
Daniel, London, in the TMS inbox
1907: Keep the emails coming, they've dried up a bit. The Windies players are out and we'll be off in a couple of minutes.
WEST INDIES INNINGS
"Here's how to look at it: if Test cricket is a long, deep and emotional relationship, and one-day cricket is a brief but passionate holiday romance, then Twenty20 is the frantic, drunken snog in a dark corner of Dukes just before the lights come up. Stick with that and you'll be fine."
Adam in the TMS inbox
"I am trying to watch this from Caracas, no cricket here just baseball and the Copa America, so shut up about the Spice Girls and focus on the cricket."
Steve, Venezuela, in the TMS inbox
"Very distressed that I can't think of anything clever at the moment to email in, especially as my friend, Sarah from Bucks, is at the match and relying on me to keep the Sarah count up. Feel a failure! This slam-bang format is definitely not conducive to my more considered approach. Apologies to Sarah for letting the side down..."
Sarah, Canterbury, in the TMS inbox
WICKET: Sammy b Anderson 1, WI 206-8
Sammy doesn't last long - one single before Anderson cleans him up with a yorker. Anderson gets one past the wild and windy woosh of Rampaul and Prior misses the run out at both ends. More rancid luck for Morton as the final ball of the innings takes out middle stump at the non-striker's end. That was nuts, and that looks like a pretty decent total for the visitors - England have it all to do. "There's definitely something creepy in the cosmos. While walking past a building site yesterday, I heard Roachford's classic 'Cuddly Toy' for the first time in nearly twenty years, and, lo and behold, here it appears again."
Sam Collier in the TMS inbox
WICKET: Smith run out (Sidebottom) 6, WI 204-7
Absolute chaos - Morton unleashes a crackerjack drive that makes a mess of the stumps at the other end, Samuels gets on his toes, Sidebottom pulls out a stump and Smith is gone. At first, Morton traipsed off, but he didn't cross and Smith is told to sling his hook instead. 19th over - WICKET: Samuels c Mascarenhas b Sidebottom 51, WI 199-6
Samuels is gone, slapping Sidebottom down Mascarenhas' neck at long-on. Smith, who crossed, carts the Notts seamer over wide long-on for four and we get a short burst of James Brown - this is bonkers, but I think I like it. 18th over - WICKET: Ramdin c Mascarenhas b Broad 24, WI 190-5
The highest score in international Twenty20s is Australia's 221 against England. Broad is on and his first delivery is a wide...but he gets rid of the pesky Ramdin, the gloveman upper-cutting him to Mascarenhas at third-man. The new man is Dwayne Smith and he can give it some rat-a-tat-tat. He short-arm jabs Broad through deep mid-wicket for a few before Samuels brings up his fifty from only 25 balls, making room outside leg-stump and skimming the ball, head-high, over the long-off boundary. That almost took a small boy's head off....he will never know how close to death he was... 17th over - WI 187-4 Samuels has put so much manners on that ball from Sidebottom, it will come back speaking like the Queen. It's actually gone out of the ground - I don't think I've ever seen anyone hit it out of The Oval - and Sir Vivian sounds like he's having a vigorous massage in the TMS commentary box, he liked that. Ramdin sweeps Sidebottom for another four, as if he's buttering a giant slice of toast, and the little wicket-keeper moves to 21 with a scythe through point for another four. Seventeen from the over, the Windies are sizzling.
16th over - WI 170-4 Skipper Collingwood is into the attack and Ramdin upper-cuts him for two. Ramdin, all 5ft 5in of him, then plays the shot of the day, jamspangling Collingwood over the fence at cover. Sir Vivian would have been proud of that bad boy. Not to be outdone, Samuels charges Colly and carts one of his dibbly-dobblies straight over long-on for six. That's gone straight into the confectionery stall...and out again...not the best bowling change for England, 17 from Colly's over.
15th over - WI 153-4 Mascarenhas plonks one in fractionally short and is yanked away by Samuels for four. Ramdin shovels Mascar over his shoulder for a couple before the Hampshire all-rounder mixes it up, getting a yorker under the windy woosh of Samuels. Prior appeals for a stumping, but Samuels had his back foot down. Mascar drops short and wide and Samuels trashes him through point for four. No let-up for England, I'm beginning to regret that little wager...
"Agree with Marc Kelly. The banter that is needed in Twenty20 is brash, surreal and at times outright startling."
Dickon Court in the TMS inbox
14th over - WICKET: Bravo st Prior b Yardy 1, WI 130-4 Five leg-side wides from Yardy before Bravo gives the bowler the charge and is smartly stumped by Prior. Ramdin is the new man and he's off the mark with a scampered single. Full-bunger from Yardy and Samuels whips him through point for a couple. Samuels collects four more with a hoick to the square-leg fence and a single with a nudge through long-on. This is exhausting... 13th over - WICKET: Smith c Yardy b Mascarenhas 61, WI 115-3
Smith's lary little innings is over as he chips Mascarenhas to Yardy at mid-wicket. Huge wicket for England, but Samuels absolutely marmalises Mascarenhas over long-off for six - he put some serious manners on that. The ball will be bowing and scraping all the way back to the middle. "I'm happy to concede that my classy but slightly ponderous email-building really has no place in the Twenty20 game."
Marc Kelly in the TMS inbox
12th over - WI 115-3 I've just bet my colleague �10 that England are going to win this, an act of bravado I think I might live to regret, especially as Anderson is called back into the attack. A shot of Morton sprawling behind the boundary rope and he serves up a bit of blue for the dads! Runako grabs his unmentionables and gives the cameraman a cheeky grin. Tremendous stuff. Anderson is swung away for four by Smith before nicking the strike with a single.
"Re Spice Girls rhyming - I think it's supposed to be 'Zee'. I love the Spice Girls (apart from Posh)."
Fergus in the TMS inbox
11th over - WICKET: Chanderpaul c Cook b Mascarenhas 97-2
That's Chanderpaul gone, chipping Mascarenhas to mid-wicket and Cook taking a fine catch diving forward. That's Dimitri's first wicket for England, but he still looks a bit like Pat Wicks/Butcher/Evans with those two rascals dangling from his ears. That's Smith's fifty, just making his ground for a couple, he he follows up with a lusty six over long-on. England hanging on for dear life here. 10th over - WI 97-1 Yardy goes up for lbw against Chanderpaul, but umpire Hartley shrugs it off. Four for Chanderpaul with a paddle round the corner before Yardy almost cleans him up, the left-hander making room and the ball just missing his off-peg. Two more for Smith with a flick to square-leg, but Yardy is doing a decent job here.
9th over - WI 88-1 More medicore fielding from England, Anderson fumbling down at fine-leg and Chanderpaul gets two. Mascarenhas is on by the way. Smith heaves Mascar over extra-cover for two more before gliding the new man away for one. A single for Chanderpaul with a sweep and that's a pretty decent first over for Mascarenhas, seven from it.
8th over - WI 81-1 Gayle, still in pads, looks like he's dozing in front of the fire in his slippers in the Windies dug-out. I haven't seen anyone as cool as Gayle since Roachford burst onto the scene in the late 80s with seminal funk-rock smash Cuddly Toy. 'Feel for me baby!' Genius, although I can't stop singing it now�Yardy still doing a job for England, he's really pushing the ball through. Smith does pick up a couple with a glove down to fine-leg. Shocking fielding from Broad at backward square-leg, dollying the ball to Prior behind the stumps like a seven-year-old girl. Two more for Smith.
7th over - WI 74-1 Broad drops short and down the leg-side and that6's a poor ball in any form of cricket - Smith feathers him round the corner for four, despite Mascasrenhas' best efforts. Another maximum for Smith, Broad bowling short and wide and the left-hander twirling over the backward-point fence. Good comeback from the Leicestershire paceman, just a few singles and a dot from the final four deliveries.
"Now, obviously I don't wish to 'dis' such a great British institution as the Spice Girls, but since when did the letter Zed rhyme with 'carefully'?"
Phil in the TMS inbox
6th over - WI 62-1 Plenty of fans still streaming into The Oval and lots of them straight from work in suits and clutching lagers. That's what it's all about...Yardy and his darts into the attack and Smith carves him down to the backward point boundary for four. Just five from the over, however, and Yardy has slammed on the brakes.
5th over - WI 57-1 Broad is into the attack, and he almost picks up a wicket with his first delivery, Chanderpaul chipping him to mid-wicket and the ball just falling short of a diving Cook. Three for the shot. Yet another boundary for Shiv, getting down on one knee and sweeping him to the square-leg fence. Broad comes close to another wicket, Chanderpaul mis-timing a steepler to long-off and the ball landing just over Sidebottom's shoulder. The tourists are smoking England's boots...
"I've adapted to Twenty20 by furiously refreshing the screen (as opposed to the casual stroke of F5 that I use for Test cricket) and simply not bothering to hide the screen when my boss walks past. Brash, like all good Twenty20 cricketers should be."
Matthew, Sunderland, in the TMS inbox
4th over - WI 47-1 Extraordinary eye from Chanderpaul, clipping Anderson down to backward square-leg for four, and Shiv picks up another boundary, Chinese cutting Anderson down to the fine-leg fence. Chanderpaul is going berserk, walking to outside off-stump and shovelling the Lancashire man to the third-man fence...and he repeats the shot! Exhilirating stuff this, I haven't hammered away at a keyboard like this since the days of Daley Thompson's Decathlon on the Acorn Electron. Anderson finds a yorker with his final delivery, and Chanderpaul digs it out for a single.
3rd over - WI 30-1 Chanderpaul picks up another single as the camera pans to Gayle in the dug-out. The big man's still padded up and he looks lsightly distant, as if someone's just told him his pet dog's just been put down. Another four from Smith, clipping Sidebottom off his pads, before he top-edges the Notts seamer for the first maximum of the day. Boos from the crowd as Smith plays a forward defensive - but he's still got 22 from seven balls...this Twenty20 lark is mental...
2nd over - WICKET: Gayle b Anderson 13, WI 13-1
Anderson gets one to rear up at Gayle, who was looking to play the flamingo shot up on one leg. Gayle gives Jimmy the charge and slaps him over mid-on for four. The big man's got his eye in...but he's gone next ball, dragging Anderson onto his stumps. I don't think people have really got Twenty20 yet, as cries of "what kind of a shot was that?" echo around my office. Chanderpaul is next up the ramp and he's off the mark with a tickle down to fine-leg. Smith looks in decent nick, whipping Anderson through square-leg for another four. 1st over - WI 9-0 Movement for Sidbottom first up, the ball shaping away from the left-handed Gayle. Gayle offers no shot to the next two deliveries and the Windies skipper is showing more application so far than he did in the Test series. Gayle does get off the mark with a single into the covers. Smith, the Devonshire variety, picks up four with an outside edge before carving Sidebottom away for four through backward point. There'll be runs in this wicket...
"Word on the street is that Monty 'is' the reason for the Chantelle-Preston split."
Chris in the TMS inbox
1728: England huddle and we're almost off...
"I heard Monty was saving himself for this match so he can get involved in some major bidding for Spice Girls tickets. Apparently they're basing a dance on his unique celebrations for the reunion gig. Although Geri may find it hard with a zimmer frame."
David Quainton in the TMS inbox
1725: So here's a story from A to Z, you wanna get with me you gotta listen carefully - that's right, the Spice Girls are back together! Collingwood's obviously Ginger, Bell must be Baby (I'm told 'he likes it in your face'), Pietersen is Posh ('he's a real lady'), Mascarenhas looks like a bit of a nutter, so he can be Scary. Which just leaves the other one - any ideas? Phil Tufnell on TMS reckons Colly said he's going to "bring a bit of ginger to the England team". I think he's just made that up.
"Now is the time for Owais Shah to break the shackles and look like he belongs at the top table. Come on Ace!"
Toby Cornes in the TMS inbox
1720:Michael Gale (see below) has brought my attention to the fact that Chantelle and Preston 'off Big Brother' have split. Poor old Preston didn't do himself any favours when he was made to look a mug on Buzzcocks - at least Chantelle can look forward to 10 years or so of snogging League One footballers down the Embassy Club.
"I've been working hard since the last Test to try and adapt my emails to the Twenty20 game. Seem to have doubled my key-stroke rate, but lost quite a lot in banter."
Chris Coyne in the TMS inbox
"Can you confirm the rumour (that I am now starting) that Monty has been left out because he is too upset about Chantelle and Preston splitting to concentrate on his cricket?"
Michael Gale in the TMS inbox
West Indies: C H Gayle (Capt), D S Smith, M N Samuels S Chanderpaul, R S Morton, D Ramdin (Wkt), D J Bravo, D R Smith D J G Sammy, R Rampaul, D B L Powell.
"Mascarenhas is a superb player and should have been called up three or four years ago. His bowling averages are almost identical to those of Sidebottom in first-class cricket, but his economy is the incredible thing. He bowls mid-70s and people just can't pick him up. He can be useful with the bat too, but is a bowling all-rounder whereas Collingwood is a batting all-rounder - they should make a great combination."
Nick in the TMS inbox
1705: Gayle has won the toss and West Indies are going to have a bat. No front-line spinners in either side...England have only played four Twenty20 matches, and won only one - against Australia in 2005. The Windies have only played one Twenty20, against New Zealand, and that ended in a tie.
"No Panesar? What's that all about? If the England selectors are going to pick a Test team for the one-dayers, they could at least have the decency to play the best Test players from the group."
George Ankers in the TMS inbox
1700: Not many English accents in that England batting order - Prior, Trott and Pietersen all trapping away in South African and now we've got Mascarenhas, who grew up in Perth. The England dressing room must sound like Walkabout in Shepherd's Bush. Shazzer's on for a double donut at Wimbledon...sorry, I'll concentrate on the cricket from now on...
"I know one of the Trott family, so I've watched him a couple of times. He starts well, and then builds quickly. I really hope he does well tonight." James, London
1650: I have to admit I haven't seen much of this Mascarenhas chap, but if Shane thinks he's pretty handy, that's good enough for me. As for Trott, I've never seen the man bat - can anyone help me out?
1642: It's my Twenty20 debut today, so be gentle with me. I see the Tiger is out of Wimbledon, and even as he tumbled, he was still polarising opinion - an almighty email row broke out among my friends as to whether they like Tim or not. In one corner: "His chin is wider than his head - he should be in a circus." In the other: "What have you ever done for England?" Lovely stuff.
England: A Cook, M Prior (wkt), IJ Trott, K Pietersen, P Collingwood (capt), O Shah, D Mascarenhas, M Yardy, R Sidebottom, S Broad, J Anderson.
1639: The England team news is that Bell, Plunkett and Panesar have been omitted and Jonathan Trott and Dimitri Mascarenhas will make their England debuts.
1635: So this is it, the first Twenty20 of the Gordon Brown era. Expect a dour encounter, with less spin than usual (allegedly), but slightly more integrity. Bit of politics! Who said the BBC was dumbing down?