Mainstream inclusion with Tom Rees, Kellie Bright and Marsha Martin

Tom Rees is advising the Government on how to do inclusion well. Nuala McGovern speaks to him about chairing the Department for Education's Expert Advisory Group on Inclusion. Tom is a former primary teacher and headteacher, now CEO of Ormiston, one of the UK's biggest chain of academy schools, plus he's dad to a son who has Down's Syndrome.

Also with us this week is Marsha Martin, founder and CEO of Black SEN Mamas - a network of over 7,000 families across the UK and beyond, and Kellie Bright, SEND mum and actor. We hear from Helen, a teacher and SENDCO who wants to talk about perhaps something unexpected - when mainstream inclusion works TOO well.

In the spotlight this week is 7 year old Will from Doncaster, who's taught himself to swim.

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Presenter: Nuala McGovern
Produced by Sarah Crawley, with Carolyn Atkinson
Digital Producer: Olivia Bolton
Executive Editor: Karen Dalziel
Produced by BBC Audio