EHCPs - an expert guide, Anna Maxwell Martin

Nuala McGovern: Welcome to SEND in the Spotlight, the podcast from the BBC that aims to reimagine support for special educational needs. I'm Nuala McGovern.

(Sig tune)

Thanks to everyone who got in touch after our first episode, like Claire, who says she is “loving the podcast so far and has recommended it to several family members and friends already.” Well, thanks for that, Claire. Also, Kirsty was in touch, she said, “I started listening to your podcast today in the car and had to come home and get in touch. It feels hugely comforting to have something to listen to that feels like it's speaking my language!” Well, if you'd like to get in touch, you can email us; [email protected], or we're on Instagram @bbcwomanshour

So to today, we are going to be tackling four letters - EHCP. Just takes a moment to say, but getting an education, health, and care plan for children with SEND can be a long and frustrating battle. In this episode, how to get one, what it means when you do, but also why the future of EHCPs is uncertain.

Well with me again is the actor and parent, Anna Maxwell Martin. And many of you will also want to hear from Alex Stafford, she is a legal expert who's going to take us through what it takes to get an EHCP, including the challenges that parents can mount when things don't go their way.

You'll meet Jade, who over the past year has been through the bruising process of obtaining an EHCP for her son. Jade will tell us what she's learned in what she calls the toughest year of her life. And as we do in every episode, we want to celebrate the wins for those in this community - today, appreciation for an amazing teacher.

So those conversations are coming up, but since we recorded them, the government has announced new funding for SEND, as many of you may have seen in the news. The BBC's education correspondent Hazel Shearing has more detail. You're very welcome, Hazel. Tell us what's been said, what has the government announced?

Hazel Shearing: Thanks very much for having me on the podcast. Um, so the Department for Education has announced 3 billion pounds to improve SEND provision in mainstream schools in England. So, it's capital funding that means it's going to be ring fenced and needs to be spent on physical improvements to schools.

So, the DFE says it will be used to help create calming spaces. For example, supporting children with needs such as autism or ADHD who may find school environments overstimulating, as well as integrated breakout spaces. And they say it will make room for mainstream schools to offer an extra 50,000 places for children and young people with SEND.

So that's a little up sum of their announcement.

Nuala McGovern: Right, well where are they getting the money from?

Hazel Shearing: The Department of Education is planning to pay for a chunk of this through money saved by cancelling some mainstream free schools that were due to be built. It says it's going to talk to local authorities about which projects will and won't go ahead. It stops short of saying all the money will come from those savings though.

Nuala McGovern: Hazel. Thank you very much. So, onto EHCPs.

(Music Sting)

Nuala McGovern: Welcome back Anna. Are you ready to chat all things EHCP?

Anna Maxwell Martin: Ready, ready, ready!

Nuala McGovern: How has your week been?

Anna Maxwell Martin: Very busy, very positive. Very life affirming and sad in equal measure. A huge response from last week's podcast, which is amazing that it's reaching lots of people, but you know, a lot of people feeling very, very desperate and so I'm pleased this is here as a cipher of information and we're going to cover something really, really important today, but it has been a bit of pointing people in the right direction, in fact, to Ipsea a few times. Obviously, it's something that's very much needed and that's, that's great!

Nuala McGovern: Now I know from the number of times that we've chatted that you are not crazy about all the acronyms and labels, let's talk about the EHCP, how do you feel about that?

Anna Maxwell Martin: I think, you know, I'm very cautious about talking about it because I know for families it is a lifeline. Many, many, many families. My, my worry is that the hoops you have to go through to get there are very, very traumatic for the family and for the child.

You also have to gather various labels into your stable before you can even start that process. Again, that's very, very difficult. Clearly there's a child that's presenting as having difficulty in school or difficulty with their emotional social health, any number of things. And actually, of course, I'm a huge advocate of schools being supported by government to meet their needs, whatever those needs may be. And that doesn't necessarily mean we have to have a label. And I think that unfortunately the labels and the process that local authority puts you through is gruelling, and it's very difficult to navigate. I mean, look. Jade, you know much more than me about navigating that system, but it's very difficult and lots of parents actually don’t know how to, so it's, it's tough.

Nuala McGovern: I'm hoping by the end of this episode that they will be armed with more information.

Jade you're so welcome to the podcast.

Jade: Thank you.

Nuala McGovern: Thank you for joining us.

Jade: Thank you for having me.

Nuala McGovern: When you contacted us, you said “thank you for giving families like ours a platform to share what the EHCP process is really like.” What is it really like?

Jade: It was, the only way I can describe it, the most difficult year of our lives for our family. It was absolutely exhausting, and we just felt completely alone in a system that we didn't really understand and we didn't really know how to navigate. Our son who struggles, he's the youngest. We have other children that sailed through school without any problems, neurotypical children, and we knew very early on with our son there was something different there and that it would look different for him, his education, but it was really hard finding the right support for him.

Nuala McGovern: And it's all been really within the past year?

Jade: It has, it's quite new to us yes. He struggled from when he started school, but things got progressively worse and we found it was getting to crisis point really. And the school was saying to us, we don't know if we can meet need anymore.

Nuala McGovern: Well, we're going to get into the details of what happened, but I do want to bring in Hazel Shearing the BBC education reporter who's going to give us a whistle stop tour of EHCPs starting with…What is one?

Hazel Shearing: What is an EHCP? Yeah, that's a pretty important place to start. So EHCP stands for Education, Health and Care Plan. It's a legal document that's given out by the local authority for children and young people with needs that can't be met through other support in school. So, an EHCP will outline the child or young person’s special educational needs as well as any health and social care needs and what special education provision is needed. So it should detail exactly what that looks like, as well as who's going to do it, and how often they're going to do it. It could say the child, for example, will have two 30 minutes sessions twice a week with a teaching assistant focusing on developing social use of language, something like that. There are a wide range of things that it could include. And they also state the name and type of school or other educational setting to be attended by the child.

Nuala McGovern: And who can apply for one?

Hazel Shearing: EHCPs are for anyone aged up to 25. So, parents can ask their local authority for an assessment if they think their child needs one. Or a young person can request an assessment themselves if they're over 16. And other people can, including doctors, health visitors, or teachers can also request them.

Nuala McGovern: You mentioned some of the aspects of when they're needed or not needed, just expand a little bit more on that.

Hazel Shearing: Yeah. It's difficult to answer exactly when they are and aren't needed because the current system assesses SEND needs on an individual case by case basis.

So, the assessment will determine whether an EHCP is needed for that particular child or not. But what is clear though is that EHCPs are the highest of three levels of support that is meant to be available for children and young people with SEND.

So, the first of those levels is called Ordinarily Available Provision. That includes everyday adjustments that schools and other settings are meant to be able to make for all pupils and it's provided by teachers and doesn't need any sort of formal identification of SEND.

The second is called SEN support, and that's for children who need more targeted interventions. It can involve the school's SEND coordinator or SENCO. Speech and Language Therapists, for example.

And EHCPs - the third level… Are meant to be for children and young people with complex and longer-term needs.

Nuala McGovern: And the political history?

Hazel Shearing: You touched on this in your overview in last week's episode I think, but the EHCPs were introduced by the Conservatives in 2014. The Children and Families Act that year introduced the two levels that we've just talked about and the different, the different levels of support we've just talked about.

Issues with the reforms have been well documented though. In 2018, for example, the Education Committee found that the reforms were the right ones, they said. But the implementation had been badly hampered by poor admin and not enough funding, essentially. And then in July last year when the current labour government came to power, Education Secretary Bridget Phillipson said “the government was committed to taking a community-wide approach in which we improve inclusivity and expertise in mainstream schools as well as ensure that special schools cater for those with the most complex needs. The government, as you said before as well, had been due to publish a White Paper setting out its reforms this autumn, but that's been pushed back to the, to the new year and there's been speculation that they could scrap EHCPs.

And I know the Schools Standards Minister was on your last episode saying, “there would always be a legal right for additional support with education, but that the government is still working out what that will look like”. And indeed, ministers haven't ruled out scrapping them, although they've been urged not to scrap them both by campaigners and MPs on the Education Select committee.

Nuala McGovern: So, we wait and see exactly what might happen to them. Thanks very much, Hazel.

Well, whether they survive the Schools White Paper or not, that Hazel was mentioning there, EHCPs are the only route that many parents feel that they can take to get their child's needs legally recognised.

Let me come back to you, Jade and to your family's experience. You gave us an indication there of just how difficult it was to get an EHCP for your child. I do want to go back to October 2024. What happened?

Jade: So, things got really bad then. He was very dysregulated at school. Often I was phoned to leave work. I was really struggling juggling a full-time job and having phone calls, constantly having to leave to collect him early. Um, if there was a school trip, I had to go and support on a one-to-one basis. So, things got really bad and school was saying to me, despite everything we've put into place, with the support of the SENCO and other agencies coming in, it wasn't getting any better. So we took the decision to move him to another school that we knew had lower school numbers and that we felt had a better SEND knowledge. And we moved him, and after the first week they agreed with us, we need an EHCP!

Nuala McGovern: Wow. That was just a week.

Jade: A week.

Nuala McGovern: Yeah. That was really quick.

Jade: Yes

Nuala McGovern: So then you need to apply to get your child assessed, what happened?

Jade: Yes. So, we applied for the assessment and waited and we were rejected. They refused to assess for an EHCP.

Nuala McGovern: That felt?

Jade: Oh, it was awful, because I just felt like I'm a real solution-based person. I thought this is what we need. And then you start catastrophising that, okay, that hasn't happened now, so now what do we do? So we took it to the next step of going to mediation then.

Nuala McGovern: To challenge?

Jade: To challenge. And despite all the evidence that we had, the full support from school. Again, it was rejected at that point.

Nuala McGovern: What did that mean for you then at that point?

Jade: Well, we were just in limbo really, because I was trying to work and look after the family, but I was constantly having to leave work to look after him. And he had such a negative feeling of himself. He was coming home saying, “Everybody hates me. Nobody likes me at school. I hate it there”. And really dysregulated, really unhappy.

Nuala McGovern: And also when he was in school, what was happening?

Jade: He was just not in the classroom very often. Leaving the classroom, throwing things, just very dysregulated behaviours really that the school just couldn’t staff. And I was completely on board with the school. I agreed with what they were saying, they had one teacher, one TA, and they couldn't give him the support that he needed.

Nuala McGovern: So he wasn't getting any education during this time?

Jade: No, he wasn't. And he was being punished for his behaviours that were out of his control, that he couldn't control in school.

Nuala McGovern: So do you accept that the local authority followed the law and codes of practice so that they refuse to assess in good faith?

Jade: No, I really feel they have a duty of care to support families, and our whole family was impacted. I started thinking, I'm going to have to leave work. It's getting worse.

I had to cut to part-time hours. It impacted our other children. It just becomes your whole life. I felt for the whole year, I lost myself completely.

Nuala McGovern: That was October 2024, when this came to a head shall we say? But then fast forward to August this year..

Jade: Yes.

Nuala McGovern: Some good news.

Jade: Some good news, a small win! We took it to tribunal and they said, “Yes they have to assess now”. So, we won the tribunal hearing, which in itself, you feel like a solicitor. I was up all hours of the night going through different documents. I did it all by myself without any support from anyone, and it felt like another job. It felt impossible.

Nuala McGovern: But the judge was clear in the findings?

Jade: Yes, you must assess for an EHCP? It's needed. Yes.

Nuala McGovern: How did that feel?

Jade: Like I say…it was a small win, but we went out to celebrate. If we've got this far and someone's listening to us now, someone's taking our concerns seriously. And actually, our son had gone all that time without the support he desperately needed, and it was hard to watch that.

Nuala McGovern: In a way that feels like a circle, you know, of what you went through but getting the right to an assessment is actually just the beginning of another process.

Jade: It is. Yes. Yeah.

Nuala McGovern: And that was a year to get to the starting line, we could say,

Jade: Yeah, it was, yes. Because once they had said “Yes, you must assess in the August” as soon as school opened again in September, the process had started and I found that to be, in our case, quite a smooth process really.

We were told, we had very clear instructions of this person's coming in today, this is going to happen. My EHCP officer made regular contact with me to see how we were doing as a family to check upon how things were going at school.

Nuala McGovern: It's so interesting, isn't it? Because. It's like parts where it's like a well-oiled machine that you're telling me about with that part.

Jade: Yes

Nuala McGovern: But the other part where it grinded to a halt.

Jade: It’sgetting to that point, yeah, yeah,

Anna Maxwell Martin: Can I just say something as well Jade? I'm sure you know similar families who have been through what you've been through.

Jade: Oh, yes.

Anna Maxwell Martin: There are so many red flags in Jade's story, but also I know many, many, many families where this year is six or seven years… Six years of your child feeling utterly lost! It is huge.

Jade: And how they are impacted by that, absolutely. His mental health was so … at such a young age, and it was heartbreaking.

Nuala McGovern: I do want to read a statement from the local authority, which we are not naming. They told us…

“Schools are equipped to meet the majority of SEND needs their pupils have. Local authorities have to apply a legal test when deciding whether a child should be assessed for an EHCP, and this considers whether a child may have SEND and may need additional provision above what a school could be expected to provide for them.

Good supporting evidence is crucial in helping to make this decision, but this can sometimes be difficult to obtain quickly from all of those who know the child the best. We work hard to ensure children and young people with complex SEND needs receive the help and support they need to thrive. However, we recognise there are significant challenges within the SEND system, so we welcome the announced SEND reforms in the New Year, and hope this removes some of the national barriers faced by children and their families and those services who support them.”

Jade?

Jade: We just didn't feel any support whatsoever. And I think what I found the most difficult, me and the school were completely on board with each other. We had luckily a good relationship, but they were saying, no, we can't offer enough support that your child needs. And they hadn't even met my child. And it was just a no, despite all the evidence that we had gathered and put together. And it's just so disheartening because it's out of your control. I'm not there with my child at school and I can't do anything about that behaviour at school. All I can do is ask for the support and the help, and we're rejected.

Nuala McGovern: How is your son now?

Jade: So, thank goodness I can say we were granted an EHCP in October half term, and already I've had no phone calls to collect. I haven't received any negative emails and it just to me is evidence to prove that with that support he's doing so much better.

Nuala McGovern: I can see the relief in your face.

Jade: Oh yes.

Nuala McGovern: And maybe your shoulders as well, as you say that to me.

(Music Sting)

You are listening to SEND In the Spotlight with me, Nuala McGovern, and with me in our studio are parents, Anna Maxwell Martin and Jade. And in this episode, we're mainly talking about EHCPs, that's Education, Health, and Care Plans. And what we're doing is giving a how to guide for parents who are navigating the EHCP system and to help us with that is Alex Stafford, who it's fair to say, is an expert on EHCPs.

Alex Stafford: Thank you.

Nuala McGovern: Good to have you with us. Um, you're a solicitor, you work for the organization Ipsea, Independent Provider of Special Education advice, how would you describe what you do?

Alex Stafford: Well, we are a charity. We are independent. We basically do what our name says, so we're funded through charitable donations from funding and also from our training that we deliver. And we provide legal advice for parents and carers of children with SEN and disabilities.

Nuala McGovern: With a very active helpline?

Alex Stafford: Yes, that's right. We have great staff and volunteers on our helplines and we have guides and template letters and things like that as well.

Nuala McGovern: I do know so many parents rely on organizations like yours,

And one of those people is the actor and mum, Kellie Bright, who our listeners will be familiar with who has been on this podcast. She can't join us in the studio today, but she did send us a voice note. She says “The EHCP process was frustrating” for her “because there's so much misinformation circulating”, so she's kicking us with a few questions.

Kellie Bright: Alex, can you tell us a bit more about what evidence is actually required to get an EHCP?

Do you have to have a diagnosis before you can get an EHCP?

Do you have to get a diagnosis from the NHS in order to get an EHCP? I know this was something I had heard many, many times, but actually in my own case, my son had a private diagnosis before we applied for his EHCP, and we still got one, eventually.

Nuala McGovern: “Eventually”, one of the words we hear quite a lot. Let's get into some of the detail with Alex of what you can do. And we're also going to be doing some myth busting as well. Are you ready for it Alex?

Alex Stafford: I am.

Nuala McGovern: Okay, so what will most parents be experiencing with their children, which makes them start to think about an EHCP?

Alex Stafford: So, most often they will be in a setting already as Jade described, and there will be difficulties that might be hard to put a pin on. School might not know what's going on, or they may. It might be to do with academics. It might have nothing to do with academics. But there'll be those difficulties. A barrier to accessing that education in some way. That's typically how it starts, although you don't have to be in a school for this process to begin, or for your concerns to start.

Nuala McGovern: Yeah or for your child to be desperately failing…

Alex Stafford: Absolutely not.

Nuala McGovern: in that, in that scenario, to start thinking about an EHCP assessment. How do you apply to be assessed?

Alex Stafford: So, it's usually by request, and that can be either from the parent or from the school or the college.

Nuala McGovern: But it's a, it's a form on a website?

Alex Stafford: There is no legal format for the request.

Nuala McGovern: Oh, really?

Alex Stafford: So most local authorities do have a preferred format, like a form or a template that might have different ones for schools and parents. Totally okay to use those. We have a template letter you can use and email. But whatever form that request takes, that's what starts the clock ticking. So that request triggers that legal process immediately.

Nuala McGovern: Let's talk about clocks because there are key milestones that the councils have to hit. What are they?

Alex Stafford: Uh, so the whole process, if you're going to end up with an EHC Plan, it should take no longer than 20 weeks. That's the maximum. And the first milestone that they have to hit is within six weeks of that request. And that's the point where they say, “yes, we're going to assess”. Or “no, we are not going to assess”. And they do apply a legal test as the, the local author's response said, it is a very low threshold test to trigger an assessment. It's just, might this child have special educational needs, those learning difficulties, those barriers to education, or do we know they've got some, and might they need more help than that can be delivered without a plan? That's it. That's it for assessment.

Nuala McGovern: So, if a council says “yes” to assessment. What does the parent need to do next?

Alex Stafford: Well. Maybe nothing except provide information if they're asked for it, and they may already have done that with their request. So, the local authority is responsible for this process. They have to get that information and advice.

There are some people they must get it from, so if it's okay, I can list them. That's the parent, the setting, if they're in one. An educational psychologist, which we've talked about health and social care, and then they have really wide discretion and sort of strategic level legal duties to commission enough sort of provision in their area to contribute to this. Very often. That might be speech therapists, occupational therapists, um. If they've got shortages in what they have commissioned, then they could get that privately themselves. There are things they have to get, and stuff they've got really wide discretion to get.

Nuala McGovern: So that is, you're on a track at that point.

Alex Stafford: That's right.

Nuala McGovern: But what about if the council says “no” like Jade experienced?

Alex Stafford: Well, at that point, that's your first point where you have a legal right of challenge. You can mediate as Jade did or appeal. You have to consider mediation. You don't have to take part. Jade did, but then you may need to appeal. Or you might just go straight to that with a mediation certificate.

Nuala McGovern: And can the council, for example, because a lot of this is about gathering information to try and make your case. Can the council use reports that families have already commissioned?

Alex Stafford: Absolutely. And that might mean they don't need to get their own. If it's sufficient, then they should use what they've been provided.

Um, they might look at it and say perhaps they don't think it's sufficient or perhaps it's out of date, and then they would get their own. But the clock is still ticking, that timeframe is still going. They can't say, “oh, we have to stop”

Nuala McGovern: Getting to the 20 weeks?

Alex Stafford: That's right. It's all still going on.

Nuala McGovern: What if the council say we're not going to consider it?

Alex Stafford: That's not lawful. They cannot do that. They have to consider what they've given. They don't have to accept it all. They can weigh it all up and see whether certain evidence chimes with other evidence, but they can't just point blank, refuse to consider it.

Nuala McGovern: And we mentioned about the six week, we mentioned about the 20. There is another target the council needs to hit.

Alex Stafford:. That's right. So once they've gathered all that information and advice, they have to look at it and say, okay, what does this child require or this young person require? And then is a plan needed to do that?

And if it is, then they'll have to go on and do that. But if not, they have to have told you by 16 weeks from that date of request.

Nuala McGovern: So this is the second decision making point…

Alex Stafford: Yes.

Nuala McGovern: .. in time where you can legally challenge the decision.

Alex Stafford: Absolutely.

Nuala McGovern: But you talked there about mediation. Is that a legal, that's a legal requirement to consider it?

Alex Stafford: It's a legal requirement to consider it, and if you want to do it, the local authority has to participate in it. But you might have already had lots of discussions and not want to, and you might go straight to appeal. You get a mediation certificate, so you need that certificate before you can appeal.

Nuala McGovern: That's interesting.

Anna Maxwell Martin: Isn't that right? That you can say, Nope, I don't want mediation. Thank you…

Alex Stafford: Yes.

Anna Maxwell Martin: ..I'm going straight to appeal.

Alex Stafford: Absolutely.

Anna Maxwell Martin: Yeah. Yeah. That's been something in common in parents I talk to. Obviously, I didn't do the system because I decided not to navigate that for my child, but for different reasons. You have got to remember there's so much parent choice here.

Nuala McGovern: But you need the certificate to say that you have been aware of it.

Alex Stafford: Yes.

Nuala McGovern: Exactly.

Okay. Let's think it's good news time, like Jade had in August. If it's a “yes”, they're going to issue an EHCP.

Alex Stafford: That's the good news. Yeah. And at that point, you'll have that information and advice that they've gathered and they'll send you the parent a draft plan. And they'll have put in the needs, and they should set them all out. And then the provision that's required to meet those needs that should be in there.

Nuala McGovern: And this is crucial really about what is in there. People often talk to me about choosing the school that their child would go to. What rights do the parents have under the current law?

Alex Stafford: Okay, so when you get that draft plan, you've got 15 days. You have to have at least 15 days to make your responses. Check it's okay. And also, you have a right to request that certain types of school are named in your plan. So it's a bit of a …

Nuala McGovern: Certain type of school, but not a specific school?

Alex Stafford: No. You can ask for specific schools, but you're right, it depends on if they fall into these certain types. So, I'm going to list them because I'm a lawyer and I like these legal lists. You can ask for a school, if it's a maintained school or an academy. And that doesn't matter if it's mainstream or special, if it is a further education institution, if it's a non-maintained special school, that's a just a different kind of special school. And then there are certain private schools that have opted into this scheme, and they're called Section 41 Independent Special Schools. So, if the school you want, or the college you want is one of those kinds, you have a right to say, “I want that school”. And the default position is, it's named in the plan.

Nuala McGovern: And can the council refuse to name that school?

Alex Stafford: They can, but there are only three reasons they can refuse to name it if it's one of those kinds. Um, and that is, again, a little legalistic, we've got information on our website with more detail, but basically, they have to also bear in mind that you've got a right to have a mainstream education if that's what you want.

But the three reasons they can reject is that it's not suitable for the age, ability, aptitude or special educational needs of the child. If the child going to the setting asked for, would be incompatible with the efficient education of others, they have to be able to identify those. Or if you were to go to that school, it would be incompatible with the efficient use of resources. But to use that argument, there has to be an alternative that's appropriate.

Nuala McGovern: Thank you so much for that detail, Alex. I think it'll be really helpful. I wanna start busting some myths as well and get some top tips. Jade, you're gonna kick us off with the myth busting.

Jade: Yes. So, a myth that I heard was our child couldn't get a EHCP because he was very bright at school. So, although he wasn't accessing his education and lots of work was coming home for us to do, we were told he's too clever almost to get an EHCP

Nuala McGovern: Alex.

Alex Stafford: That is a myth. (Laughter)

No, because obviously learning difficulty doesn't mean I'm not very good academically. You can have difficulties with learning or, um, the barriers to accessing education across the spectrum of ability, so that is a myth.

Nuala McGovern: I want to get into some of Kellie's questions. Um, this is a bit of a quick fire for you, Alex.

Alex Stafford: Okay.

Nuala McGovern: Is an EHCP only for children who are physically disabled?

Alex Stafford: No.

Nuala McGovern: Do you need a diagnosis to get an EHCP?

Alex Stafford: No.

Nuala McGovern: Do you have to have an NHS diagnosis?

Alex Stafford: No.

Nuala McGovern: Is a private diagnosis acceptable?

Alex Stafford: Yes.

Nuala McGovern: Do academies…

Anna Maxwell Martin: We're all told they're not. We're all told they're not.

Jade: I paid for a private diagnosis, yes, and had an NHS letter the day after!

Anna Maxwell Martin: Yeah, we're all told not to do that. If you do that.. I've got people all over my Instagram… We are all told if you pay for anything, if you find the money and you pay.. because the waiting list is so long, that's it! You're screwed! And actually, Alex just said that's just not true. So, that's such good information.

Jade: Yeah, I heard the same thing as you.

Nuala McGovern: Interesting.

Do academies have to follow the same legal rules as state schools?

Alex Stafford: Absolutely.

Nuala McGovern: If you have an EHCP, do you automatically get transport to school?

Alex Stafford: No.

Nuala McGovern: Is it only available for five to 16 year olds?

Alex Stafford: No, nought to 25.

Anna Maxwell Martin: Can I do a myth buster? Just one, one to do with attendance?

Nuala McGovern: Please..

Anna Maxwell Martin: Of course, as we know, attendance goes hand in glove with a child that's dysregulated, is struggling, doesn't have a sense of safety in school. Their needs are not being met in school through no fault of the teachers. Can I just make that very important point. Uh, if we had 1 million more TAs in this country, we would really value them so much.

Jade: Yeah.

Anna Maxwell Martin: Um, but attendance, they can't deny you anything just based on the attendance record?

Alex Stafford: No. No.

Anna Maxwell Martin: Okay.

Nuala McGovern: Alex, let us finish up with your top tips. Get your pen and paper ready.

Alex Stafford: Okay. So, you do not have to wait for your child or young person to fail before you can start thinking about or requesting an EHC needs assessment.

The second one is, when you make that request, or when the school or college did it for you, put the date in the diary and then write those deadlines into your diary. And if they are approaching and you are not hearing anything, or you don’t know where you are. Contact the local authority and chase to say what's going on? Don't wait for those deadlines to come and go. If you can keep on top of it, do.

The next one is, parents sometimes wonder..what evidence? What's relevant? I don't know! You know loads about your child; you'll have loads of information. Just send it all in with your request or when they ask for information, then they will have to consider it. And you know, if there's something in there that's not relevant because it's 10 years old, they'll just put that to one side, but they have to consider it all. So, send it all in. And the last one I would say is when you get that draft plan, do check all that information and advice and really make sure that B and F are clear.

Nuala McGovern: These are two sections?

Alex Stafford: So, section B is about the need, and section F is the provision, and that's the bit that's enforceable, that's the bit that's got Jade’s son, all of that help…

Jade: Yep.

Alex Stafford: ..In place. And it has to be secured by the local authority. So it shouldn't be vague. It shouldn't be meaningless. Really clear like.

Like a contract, but it can be in everyday language. It should be in everyday language. So we can all understand it, but we need to know what's in there. So double check and then use that 15 days to tell them if there's things' wrong.

Anna Maxwell Martin: That's so good.

Jade: It is so good.

Anna Maxwell Martin: Boom. Yes.

No, because we don't, just don't know any of that, you know.

Nuala McGovern: So, I'm so glad, that you were here Alex, uh, Alex Stafford who's from Ipsea. So much practical advice there around EHCPs.

I also want to read a statement. This is the local government association, which represents local authorities in England. They say,

“More children with special educational needs should get the care and support they need in schools and other mainstream settings without the need for a statutory plan.

In the Schools White Paper, we are calling for an overhaul of the current system. Where while in some cases an EHCP will be appropriate for most children, they will get the support they need in schools without needing an EHCP. We want to see an inclusive education system where an EHCP is not necessary.

With a workforce that has the capacity and right skills, we must end the adversarial nature. Off the current system where no child should have to fight for a statutory plan. Instead, we need a system whereby children get the right support at the right time and are not left behind.”

Alex?

Alex Stafford: There's a lot of sentiments there that I do not disagree with, but the one thing that always, always irritates me doing the job I do is the system is not built to be adversarial. If everybody did the things that they were legally required to do when they were legally required to do them, we would not have to fight. You shouldn't ever expect a public body to be forced to full fill its legal obligations.

(Music Sting)

Nuala McGovern: Each episode, we're putting someone in the spotlight who's done something that deserves to be celebrated. It could be your child for doing something that you never thought they could or would, or it can be an adult who has supported and helped your child. Alice emailed us [email protected] to tell us about a teacher who's made a huge difference to her two teenage boys.

(Music)

Alice: Hi, my name is Alice and I have two children with SEND in a London state mainstream secondary school. The whole SEND department is brilliant. It really is. It's fantastic. But I'd like to give a special mention to Mrs. Robinson who is basically like Ms. Rabbit from Peppa Pig in human form. She does so much for the children in the school, especially those with SEND, mental health difficulties, or other vulnerabilities.

(Music)

Boy 1: I am year 11 and I'm doing my GCSEs next year. Ms. Robinson has really helped me by advocating for me and making sure that other teachers understand about my ADHD. She's kind and friendly. Thank you a lot Ms. Robinson.

Alice: She absolutely rocks. She listens; she cares. She advocates for our children. I think that I must be a giant thorn in her side 'cause I'm always emailing her or having meetings with her, but she's just always lovely, incredibly responsive, very supportive, and works incredibly hard.

Boy 2: She has helped me with my ADHD and autism. She listens to me and helped me find my voice. She's super kind and nice. She wears DMs like my mum, which is super cool. She's a very hardworking lady.

Alice: And what would you like to say to Mrs. Robinson?

Boy 2: Thank you, Mrs. Robinson and Miss Kay, my LSA. You are the best.

Alice: Thank you very much, Mrs. Robinson, because you have made all the difference.

(Music)

Nuala McGovern: Alice and her two boys there putting their teacher, Mrs. Robinson in the spotlight. If you would like to do the same for someone you feel should be featured, please email us, [email protected]. And I want to let you know in the next episode, we're going to be talking about all things Christmas and how to deal with the holiday season.

Joining me in the studio will be two dads, Andy and Gareth. Their swapping from their Autism Dad Cast to come and chat with us here. It's going to be the highs, the lows, the fun bits alongside the trauma and chaos that school holidays can bring. Let us know how you navigate it. Email us, [email protected].

Plus, we'll be hearing from one young woman who loves Christmas and lives Christmas 365 days a year.

But until then, thanks from Jade, Anna, Alex, and me.

All: Goodbye! (Laughter)

ends