Monday 19 April 2010

In the Independent:

'The Institute of Public Police Research (ippr) conducted analysis exploring the roots of the BNP's support.

They found that the more immigration an area has experienced, the lower its support for the far right.

Instead the study suggests that political and socio-economic exclusion such as a lack of qualifications and poor social cohesion are more important factors of BNP support. '

Could it be also due to people being naive and gullible about such BNP poses as "we are not a Nazi Party" - they just mostly have supporters who like National Socialism?

The Holocaust "was made up" and so on.

The kind of area where when somebody says that Collett (BNP publicity) is arrested for threatening to kill Griffin (BNP leader) they say "yeah but they are still doing well" people believe them?

Labour are playing the bad sister in Cinderella and having let Cinders out of the kitchen (of unequal publicity) they still expect Cinders to help woo the Prince (the electorate) for the ugly bad sister who likes lobbying and so on.

The Tories meanwhile are reacting like Clash of the Titans (old version) where the valiant but bemused Cameron has seen Medea (Labour) sow the teeth of some old monster on the ground that have sprung up into a new army.

So Labour have not grasped that there is no such thing as the anti-Tory vote these days as they have very similar policies to the Tories.

The Tories cannot grasp that its not just a question of their turn and they are not addressing the policies that people want.

The surge in support for the Lib Dems may not continue but both of the old corrupt parties should think about how an electorate will react to a new government that exists due to the skewed electoral system distorting the vote so that the will of the people is over-ridden at the start of their term.

I hope people will note that the mighty Vince Cable is not like Sarah Palin and that if Emily M. interviews him she won't have to open bottles of water for him "at the appropriate time" and Lear jets are not very environmentally friendly - and probably won't be flying for some time.

What is the situation on the AfPak border and are we seeing more Pakistani activity in a cohesive way with the allies?

Is the "war on drugs" the primary way to cut Talib funds?

Is Karzai expanding on his recent comments?

"And Paul Mason will be asking why Labour is the only party not proposing to do something on a national, sovereign scale about banking."

Because they are the most vulnerable to the charge that their extolling the light touch regulation and the ingenuity of the financial markets (like derivatives that nearly sank us) mean they have the most to lose?

But I have to say that their needs to be tougher regulation, new fraud laws and accounting rules nationally, regionally and globally and none of the parties - even the Lib Dems - are being as comprehensive as I would like to see.

"The body that represents the world's airlines, IATA, has criticised Europe's governments for the way they closed air space because of volcanic ash.

Tonight, we'll be seeking a response to the criticism from within business and government."

Sadly, there have just been far too many instances where 'official bodies' have been shown to be shaped or used to further some other agenda, for the viewing public to take all that they're told at face value.

The media hasn't presented enough critical coverage of the Icelanic erruption (e.g. in the context of volcanic eruptions elsewhere in the world and the impact these have had upon air traffic) to make recent decisions credible. Whilst the EU is largely grounded, the USA, and other carriers, will now be doing a roaring trade in air freight elsewhere on the globe, costing our economies whilst favouring theirs.

This icelandic event will be used as yet another opportunity for some to highlight the global (non nationlist) nature of the economy, at a time when there's pressure on national governments to regulate given the Goldman Sachs saga and other debacles.

Natural events like this eruption can be abused for political agendas to shape electorate's values.

Having watched the weather forecast from the BBC for a very long time they almost always get it wrong. Yesterday it was forecast to be grey overcast - it is sunny and bright as observed from my window. Multiply that for about 25 years with a few exceptions and you have the UK weather forecast.

The BBC is just facing up to its increasing irrelevance being as we find news totally free and more compelling due to its relevance else where. So who gives a fig about 'Adrian Chiles quits BBC' and 'Mr Ross'? 3.6 billion of irrelevance to enforce the class system of Ox-bridge ego employment. Stupid childish stories - plastic bottles with Co2, OAP's made to do stupid things and 'Ethical man' - crikey.

thegangofone [#5] "But I have to say that their needs to be tougher regulation, new fraud laws and accounting rules nationally, regionally and globally and none of the parties - even the Lib Dems - are being as comprehensive as I would like to see."

Which raises the eternal question as to how one gets national and global regulation without effective state enforcement, and as enforcement means policing, and state policing is totalitarian, for decades we've seen erosion of this in West, all in the interest of the markets naturally regulating value and behaviour (see PBS Frontline's 'The Warning'). Many say there's evidence that this approach has failed (even Greenspan), but nobody seems to be willing to propose what the solution is, probably because they have spent so many decades arguing the opposite?

Do you have a solution?

#6

Natural events like this eruption can be abused for political agendas to shape electorate's values.

Certainly can Math! Just heard on the radio that the government (i.e.labour party) is running to the rescue of all those stranded brits. Sending royal navy ships to collect these poor lost people. How many votes will that earn labour! ; )

More from Janet Tavakoli :-

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/janet-tavakoli/propublicas-and-ny-times_b_542441.html

Persons in power should have read and acted on her books, maybe they did but couldn't do anything.

Maybe Jewish hegemony in the Western liberal democracies is finally being exposed!

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/vicky-ward/senior-goldman-exec-is-ma_b_542154.html

Maybe the answer to IATA is that all except the Met Office (which is an independent government owned agency) are not in the public sector. So I hope you will ask them. Since COBRA has met today perhaps the Government will do something but who will pay? As I recall it those affected in the Dunkirk affair did not sit on their backsides either.

This will presumably help Iceland's balance of payments for a few days at least.

Of course, Iceland isn't in the EU (yet) either. So EU wide dictats on flights presumably don't apply there or to Norway, which is as free of dust/fallout as the PIGS. Surely an act of God?

Maybe this is just fall-out for EU non PIGS and similar political/economic miscreants?

Move that money -

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/19/move-those-dollars-anti-u_n_542400.html

It looks like up to 2/3 of the 300,000 or so Icelanders don't relish the idea of joining the EU.

I wonder why? Could it be all that open border/free passage around Europe? Could it be how indebted they see Greece and Eire now are thanks to helpful bankers and regulations which they will have no control over?

flicks [#10] "Persons in power should have read and acted on her books, maybe they did but couldn't do anything."

Exactly. Janet still appears to live in Oz or Wonderland where fine words and outrage are all that matter.

You appear to be somewhat wiser in that perhaps you can now better see the real contraints which make sound analysis and action so much harder than many like to think.

It isn't a matter of just having good ideas. It's a matter of working within the contraints of the law. Outside of which lies crime, corruption and war.

This does tend to make 'working with reality' the feeling that one is having to wade through treacle.

I had an uncle who was on one of the last boats from Dunkirk in 1940 and was in hospital for six months....that was sressful. In 1783 when this volcano went up we hade famine thoughout Europe for eight months and later we had the French revolution...that was stressful. Waiting six hours at Calais is not stressful and makes me slightly ashamed of our race....

#107

Too much info about the bidder, BYT? Poor creature. Stuck somewhere with electrodes and buttons, probably not having the time to look at the sky or breathe fresh air and 'uncomfortable' 'dreaming' of what could have been.

Ah, all those miscalculations, misjuddgements and missed opportunities !

mim

Just as well you're not a news presenter, BYT, as you would have your wrists slapped for trying to 'know' too much.

mim

In the Guardian there is an interesting clip with Billy Bragg talking to Richard Barnbrook of the BNP in Dagenham. Barnbrook is the church bells + dyslexia leads to him citing local murders that never happened.

I applaud Bragg though really they want to be showing that the Hitler loving Collett arrested for threatening to kill his BNP leader Griffin is what they are all about.

Is Barnbrook onside with one or both factions?

#8 math ap mathonwy

"Which raises the eternal question as to how one gets national and global regulation without effective state enforcement, and as enforcement means policing, and state policing is totalitarian"

You really are ridiculous as policing is not totalitarian and nobody is going to vote in, for instance, the BNP to introduce National Socialist tyranny any time soon.

The solution is to have better international agreement and national standards as if the banks can't make money by not complying then they will start to realise that they can't get away with risk taking on the public expense account anymore.

#6 math ap mathonwy

"This icelandic event will be used as yet another opportunity for some to highlight the global (non nationlist) nature of the economy"

OK lets look at a nationalist response - Griffin says London is not a British city and that he would get rid of the banks and would build "things" and sell the "things" around the world.

Its quite clear that you have no idea why some people, and me in particular, think that the far right froth at the mouth.

Turkeys voting for Christmas

I had to laugh at Philip Pullman's intrview in the Guardian today where he says he hopes the "wretched" Catholic Church is finished completely by the abuse scandals. This is the guy who has made a lot of money out of establshed religions - His Dark Materials - and is now seemingly punting a book about Jesus having a twin; where would his inspiration have come from if these institutions he has apparently such disdain for did not exist? Would he have got away with saying the same things about the Jewish faith? I'm sure his sales will get a boost anyway.

#17; ingenuity, determination and necessity being the mother of invention would see these stories of travellers' exploits replicated in many, if not all countries affected; these qualities are not exclusively British and it is ,I agree, in dreadfully bad taste to equate the current difficulties with Dunkirk, the lowest point in European history since Napoleon's defeat at Waterloo.

#11 debtjuggler

"Maybe Jewish hegemony in the Western liberal democracies is finally being exposed!"

As I have said many times in the past the far right with their talk of the "Jewish hegemony" are as likely to produce evidence to support their mental malaise as you are to see flying pigs barrel roll in salute to the BNP at their conference-in-a-field.

Your ridiculous notion for instance is seemingly based on the fact that some of the people involved have Jewish names.

In nearly a hundred years since Hitler its not an accident that the far right have never come up with any hard evidence of this alleged "Jewish hegemony".

By contrast the hideous acts of the Nazis have been exposed at Nuremburg and the world knows full well about the Holocaust.

15 Math wrote:

It looks like up to 2/3 of the 300,000 or so Icelanders don't relish the idea of joining the EU.

I wonder why? Could it be all that open border/free passage around Europe? Could it be how indebted they see Greece and Eire now are thanks to helpful bankers and regulations which they will have no control over?

--------------------------------------

That and the fact that they probably don't want a load of freeloaders over-whelming the valuabale resources of their state health and education systems (oh...and privatising them!)...

'Iceland is one of the healthiest countries in the world. It has low pollution, high life expectancy and an extremely low rate of infant mortality. The health service is well organised, progressive and has more doctors per head of population than any other country. There is no private health sector in Iceland and all citizens regardless of status qualify for healthcare under the state healthcare service.'
https://www.europe-cities.com/en/633/iceland/health/

#15 math ap mathonwy

"It looks like up to 2/3 of the 300,000 or so Icelanders don't relish the idea of joining the EU.

I wonder why? Could it be all that open border/free passage around Europe? Could it be how indebted they see Greece and Eire now are thanks to helpful bankers and regulations which they will have no control over?"

So you think they will all start making funny salutes, goose stepping and adopt National Socialism?

They are far too sensible to be taken in by any far right snake oil salespeople.

"It is expected that the SEC case against Goldman could open the floodgates for other suits after Dutch bank Rabobank accused Merrill Lynch of embarking on a similar practice when selling it a CDO."

https://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/apr/19/goldman-sachs-defence-fraud-allegations

The Guardian Monday 19th April

First they will make the case that this was legal (which it probably was, venal or not), second this will cost lots of money to prosecute, and third, if the floodgates do open, all hell will be let loose, as these corporations are collectively bigger than governments, have lobbied for small government and the markets as arbitrators of 'what works' as an ideology for decades, and they have prevailed too. Watch 'The Warning'.

Adrian Douglas getting into some detail on unallocated accounts and parallels with the Goldman Sachs fraud allegations.

Seriously the FSA needs to read this :-

https://www.gata.org/node/8557

'If you buy a lifeboat on the Titanic, you want a lifeboat on the Titanic. You don't want an IOU for a lifeboat on the Titanic, where, if no lifeboats are available, you may be offered a settlement in cash.'

The Road a head :-

https://www.chicagotribune.com/business/sns-ap-us-goldman-sachs-legal-storm,0,1061669.story


"This is just the tip of the iceberg," said James Hackney, a professor at Northeastern University School of Law. "There are a lot of folks out there in different deals who played similar roles, and once it starts building steam, plaintiffs' lawyers will figure out this is where the money is and there should be a lot of action."

So, if 'nobody saw the drivers of the Credit Crunch', how did John Paulson manage to make so much money hedging against the trend?

https://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703574604574499740849179448.html

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN1613116120100419

See the last graphic especially. [Unsuitable/Broken URL removed by Moderator]

It took three years after being charged to get this criminal banged up :-

https://www.sfo.gov.uk/press-room/latest-press-releases/press-releases-2010/ponzi-schemer-jailed-for-ten-years.aspx

Three years ! And how long will he eventually serve maybe 5 - 7 years and how many lives did he ruin along with the other Ponzi morally wasted sociopath criminals, which seems to include pretty much the whole financial system.

thegangofone [#26] "They are far too sensible to be taken in by any far right snake oil salespeople."

But they weren't 'sensible enough' not to be taken in by 'far-right' predatory mortgage (and other loan) brokers were they?

Are you sure that you have a sound grasp of what's going on in the world today? You appear to have a unique world-view which is at odds with what's actually the case. Your view is quite the opposite of what is true in fact.

The people who have been making all the money in recent times are the right-wing. The people who are opposed to that behaviour are left-wing. I don't mean to be rude to you, I just don't understand what you are posting. It makes as much sense to me as posts from mimpromptu.

The IMF is right-wing. So is Wall Street. Do you understand that? Or do you just call anyone you don't like 'right-wing'? You keep telling us that 2+2=5 as far as I can tell. Please explain why you do this, as you are obviously passionate about what you believe, and I'd like to be of help.

DebtJuggler [#25] You wait, someone will start calling them racists next. It's generally how this game is played. Those who want to make money hate well regulated welfare states. I see the Icelandic problems as just another illustration of the hit on welfare states we have seen everywhere else. As with Greece, lure them into the money business and then spring the trap in order to cripple their 'fascist' public services.

How can these people get away with calling those who care for people 'nazis' etc? It's like paranoid people accusing WHO or The Red Cross of just wanting to stab children with little swords (hypodermic needles), and others believing the paranoics. There are lots of these people about. The lay terms for them is superstitious/ignorant and/or mad people. I can think of other examples, but I'm sure others can too. It just takes a few mad people to misread what's being done, for wild rumours to run amok throughout groups.

thegangofone [#24] "Your ridiculous notion for instance is seemingly based on the fact that some of the people involved have Jewish names."

Why is it 'ridiculous'?

Have a closer look into the population of New York City. Its largest group (i.e over a quarter of the population of 8 million) is Hispanic. Next is the Black American population which is just a little bit smaller. Then there's the White American population, which is in fact predominantly Jewish (i.e. only about 800,000 of the 2.8 million Whites in NYC are in fact non Jewish White Catholios/protestants). The next smallest group which is about the same size as the White Protestants/Catholics is the East Asian Amercian group. One doesn't see many East Asians or Hispanics or Blacks, or Christian Whites in the financial news. This is why Wall Street seems so predominantly Jewish. Jews do much better at school and university too. The fact seems to be that more of the names are Jewish because there are more Jewish people in senior positions in this line of work.

Why is that that so hard to accept? Do you have a problem with this? This has been written about all over the place, and a lot of Jewish people appear to be very proud of it.

#30 you've stopped HTML linking onto words , drop in standards or has someone else taken over? anyways sure gango will address.

thegangofone [#11] "You really are ridiculous as policing is not totalitarian and nobody is going to vote in, for instance, the BNP to introduce National Socialist tyranny any time soon."

You've done it again, you have misread what is written. Look up state policing and totalitarianism. What is the relationship between the state and the police?

"The solution is to have better international agreement and national standards as if the banks can't make money by not complying then they will start to realise that they can't get away with risk taking on the public expense account anymore."

The crucial question is how ones does that without enforcement of the agreements? This is the crux of the problem. Enforcement of agreements requires tight regulation, compliance or policing. Like people, organizations have shown that they can not be trusted to police themselves. Regulation/compliance is exactly what was abandoned to make Financial and Business Services and the free-market prosper in recent decades. What was abandoned was the last vestiges of a police state. You keep criticizing (abusing) the very behaviours which are required to prevent financial crimes, public misery and abuse. Why?

thegangofone [#24] What you need to grasp is that clever people get the rules (laws) made in free societies in order to suit their group best interests. They then play by these rules in order to win against their competitors. That's legal. Denying this is silly as it's a fact that in free societies people are encouraged to compete in this way, and they form groups in order to do it.

Life isn't fair in free societies. Socialist societies try to be fair.

We do have a choice in how to handle the upcoming financial implosion.

We can either leave the markets to pick out the weak, hold nations and Governments to ransom, or implement a managed phasing out of the underlying toxic stuff.

Here are three clear policies to reign in the shadow banking sector that can be phased in:

1) Tobin style tax on all financial transactions (starting low e.g. 0.001%, then ramping up)
2) Simple ban on "naked" short selling, default swaps etc.
3) No new "originate-to-distribute" loan creation, with phased restoration of existing arrangements (see below)

"It should be clear by now that a litany of doorstep regulations (such as Sarbanes-Oxley) are impotent in the face of financial gerrymandering. There is only one reform needed to tame the dubious excesses of modern banking, and that is to end the originate-to-distribute model of loan creation."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/newsnight/paulmason/2010/04/reshaping_the_banks_the_missin.html

Previously we regulated banks and financial systems by clearly stating what limited activities they CAN do. Now we have the highly bamboozling situation of banks pretty much able to whatever they want to do, unless a regulator expressly says they CANNOT do it.

They have turned the concept of banking regulation inside out!

milliband said '“The 2010 election is not about Iraq,'....

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/election-2010/7607998/David-Miliband-says-the-UK-would-not-have-invaded-Iraq-if-we-knew-what-we-knew-now.html


oh yes it is. and Afghanistan.

the lib dem were against the war. which party is now in third place?

'fairness' model praised by all the parties requires human sacrifice if not cruelty.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/7603694/Pensioner-blocked-from-NHS-operation-for-having-a-private-consultation.html

not much good in the 'fairness' model which is why it is rational to want the model based on the good.

Have a look at the IN MAPS pic. See how the politically correct volcanic ash cloud knows how to avoid the EU PIGS (Portgual, Italy, Greece and Spain) and the non EU states (Iceland and Norway)? The PIGS can't economically afford to have their planes grounded. Will they make some dosh whilst the richer liberal states are grounded? Is this a way to help their economies a little, a bail-out through the back-door?

#38 - naked short selling is what is keeping gold from going through the roof and fiat money from going down the pan, gov's are 'allegedly' doing this via JP Morgan and HSBC. Witness Fridays take down of gold on the day Goldman Sachs was accused of fraud - it should have spiked a high. Look up Andrew Maguire if you haven't already.

Reeta Chakrabarti gets the brownie points today for her attire on The Daily Politics - it was a joy to view.

I don't care who gets into power the single most important thing will be the value of fiat money - it will bleach everything else out. And everyone reading this should be in no doubt as to the seriousness of precious metals being allegedly leveraged 100-to-1 and manipulated. Just remember the 'useful idiot' who brought this to you. It wasn't the mainstream media.

#41 Have to say that is very funny.

flicks [#35] Focus on what matters instead of what's incidental.

42. flicks "..everyone reading this should be in no doubt as to the seriousness of precious metals being allegedly leveraged 100-to-1 and manipulated. Just remember the 'useful idiot' who brought this to you. It wasn't the mainstream media."

Please explain why precious metals (like gold and silver) are precious now that the world no longer ties the value of money to gold and silver. Explain how it has value independently of market demand talked up by people such as yourself. How does it differ, say, from tulips of old, or recent property values, for example? Why is this not another bubble?

ARE VANGUARD (TRIDENT) SUCCESSOR CLASS SUBS LIKELY TO BE NEEDED BY THE UK AND ITS ALLIES IN THE FUTURE??

Future basis for nation-to-nation conflicts and the UK's strategic Interests in the coming century:

1) During the coming decades is it absolutely impossible that a South American country will develop nuclear weapons??

2) Do Central and South America's countries' two centuries of revolving door, very often abusive-to-human rights dictatorships, exportation of illicit narcotics and erratic- often hugely destabilizing- foreign policies bode well for countries in other parts of the world during the coming decades?

3) Is there evidence that Central and South America's countries' well established propensities for: military dictatorships; excessive involvement of their militaries in governmental and justice system structures; civil service corruption; dysfunctional legal systems; AND mal-governance generally...

will change in a positive direction- PERMANENTLY- during the coming decades?

If the answer is 'no' to any of the above, then countries with pivotal, central, constructive roles on the world stage- such as the United Kingdom- that in the coming decades wish to deter a South American country and/or defend themselves from it- will be grievously disadvantaged without robust, irrefutably capable and HIGHLY VISIBLE 'global reach' militaries...

Of the 3 main types of military services (Army, Air Force & Navy), only a properly resourced 'blue water' Navy- possessing a substantial and exceedingly capable subsurface forces' component- can provide a country with CONSTRUCTIVELY DETERRENT- global reach...

During the last 12-years, Labour's defence funding policies- and their incredibly damaging results- could not have gone unnoticed by hostile and potentially hostile state and non-state actors world-wide....

In coming years, persons and states with existing (and who develop new) animus towards the UK and its interests can only gain advantage and become emboldened if Labour's short-sighted, TREASONOUSLY INADEQUATE defence funding AND NEGLIGENT LONG TERM PLANNING practices and their hugely damaging results are not rectified...

While it is true that Argentina does not possess an up-to-date, well trained armed forces, its immediate Continental partners and friends- in relevant areas- do, and during the last 1/2 decade have regularly mused and made threatening-to-the UK statements about how- in aid of Argentina- their armed forces would demolish the UK's:

A) "Chavez vows revenge for Falklands war":
https://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article2368707.ece

".... IN a new outburst of anti-western sabre-rattling, President Hugo Chavez of Venezuela has threatened Britain with "revenge" for the Falklands war of 1982…." "The belligerent Latin American leftist warned last week that his recent build-up of sophisticated Russian and Iranian weapons would be used to destroy the British fleet if it attempted to return to the South Atlantic..."

B)https://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article2368707.ece :

"Chavez... has reportedly ordered nine Russian diesel submarines, including the (anti-ship SS-N-27 "Sizzler" rvl) cruise missile-carrying 677E Amur-class vessel.

"...The Venezuelan pilots.. would soon be training with medium-range BrahMos missiles, a supersonic anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM) jointly developed by India and Russia...

"... US officials also fear that Chavez may be seeking nuclear technology from his contacts with Iran and North Korea. "He is discussing a possible joint programme with Tehran to build an unmanned drone aircraft similar to the American Predator and has long been engaged in a regional attempt to promote military cooperation against the US..."

C) "Brazil attacks (UK) over Falklands stand-off" 24_02-2010:
https://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article7039257.ece

D) "Brazil-China agreement signed for training China's (Navy) PLAN to operate aircraft carriers", 04_02-2010:
(in Vietnamese- requires translation service such as Yahoo or Google)
https://vitinfo.com.vn/Muctin/Quansu/THSK/LA72763/default.htm

E)"Brazil concludes major procurement deal with France", 11_09-2010:
https://www.janes.com/news/defence/jdw/jdw090911_4_n.shtml :

".... Brazil and France have signed a military cooperation agreement for the construction of four new conventional submarines for the Brazilian Navy. "... Under a National Defence Strategy, finalized at the end of 2008, Brazil aims to establish a second fleet to protect the country's north and north east regions...."

"... To equip the new fleet, the navy plans to build (with foreign companies' assistance/involvement) three nuclear submarines, fifteen conventional submarines, two aircraft carriers, four amphibious assault ships, six general-purpose Frigates, four air-defence Frigates, 20 corvettes, 12 ocean patrol cutters and 48 patrol boats..."

Once acquired by Brazil- as a result of France's arms sales- will Brazil be a reliable custodian of sensitive US/UK/NATO technologies that might be compromised and/or misused if not handled properly- especially when being incorporated into Brazilian military/naval uses??

Brazil has an up and running space programme as well as a capable and expanding nuclear technology and energy industry...

F) "China's New Missile May Create a 'No-Go Zone' for U.S. Fleet" 17_11-2009:
https://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601080&sid=annrZr9ybk7A

Will China sell this missile to South American/other countries in future decades??

G) "China Naval Modernization: Implications for U.S. Navy Capabilities", 19_11-2008:

Unlike other BBC web site blogs, the self-styled investigative Newsnight programme blog's censors regularly remove my submitted-comments' links to US Congressional Research Service military & defence programme documents...

- Or, regularly, the Newsnight blog censors refuse to post my comments entirely if they contain links to US Congressional Research Service military & defence programme documents...

... usually under the vacuous pretense that comments containing links to PDF format documents are prohibited on the Newsnight programme blogs...

So, rather than include a link with this comment to the PDF format US Congressional Research Service document:

"China Naval Modernization: Implications for U.S. Navy Capabilities", from November 19-2008 ,

instead, readers of this page can go to an HTML format page:

https://opencrs.com/

and then either:

A) type into this page's search box: "China Naval Modernization: Implications for U.S. Navy Capabilities", or

B) type the "China Naval Modernization: Implications for U.S. Navy Capabilities", report number- RL33153- into the search box... and then- among the search results- locate the version from November 19-2008:

Page CRS-92:
"Surface Ship (Anti-Air Warfare) AAW Upgrades...
"Are current (US) Navy plans for upgrading surface ship anti-air warfare (AAW) capabilities adequate?

"The PLA's (China's Navy's) acquisition of advanced and highly capable ASCMs such as the SS-N-27 Sizzler and the SS-N-22 Sunburn raises the question of whether current plans for modernizing (US) Navy surface ship AAW capabilities are adequate..."

China is known to be marketing clones of the SS-N-27 and other anti-ship cruise missiles (ASCM's) world-wide...

Why is a technologically up-to-date, adequately sized & properly planned Royal Navy- possessing both sub-surface and surface combatants that are 'fully equipped'* with weapons, communications and defensive systems needed??

Answer- "Falklands' war tested modernized Super Etendard in Argentine Navy's agenda", 21_02-2010:

https://en.mercopress.com/2010/02/21/falklands-war-tested-modernized-super-etendard-in-argentine-navy-s-agenda

"... The possible transfer to Argentina of a refurbished model of the French manufactured fighter-bomber Super Etendard, which had an outstanding performance during the 1982 Falkland Islands conflict, is under consideration by the French Ministry of Defence..."

* in order to save money, the UK’s new Type-45 Destroyers and the planned 'big deck' aircraft carriers' are being built & commissioned into service without 80% of the basic, industry-standard weapons, defensive systems & sensors that their designers' originally intended- and that in other 1st world countries' navy's are mandatorily fitted to new Destroyers, aircraft carriers and similar surface combatants.....

If the UK's new Destroyers, aircraft carriers (and Frigates) continue to be built as grievously stripped down, neutered facade's, and if currently in-service, front-line surface combatants'- such as the RN's 2 remaining aircraft carriers- continue to not have their obsolescent Sea Dart anti airborne threat weapons systems- which were removed to save money in the late 1990's**- replaced with up-to-date systems: doesn't this justify building of MORE, NOT LESS, AND BIGGER MORE CAPABLE subsurface combatants such as the Vanguard successor (Trident) class and Astute class subs??

** All other countries on earth with navy's possessing aircraft carriers- such as the US, Italy, France, Japan and even Brazil- make sure that their carriers are either fitted at commissioning or refitted regularly with technologically up-to-date anti airborne threat missile systems:

Brazil makes sure that its nearly 50-year old Aircraft Carrier is fitted with up-to-date, missile-based anti airborne threat defence systems:

"Refitted Sao Paulo returns to sea", 08_01-2010 :

https://www.janes.com/news/defence/naval/idr/idr100108_1_n.shtml -

..."(As a result of the refit, the Sao Paulo has) three new twin-Mistral surface-to-air missile launchers "...

For the UK Labour govt to have not funded the same for the Royal Navy's 3 aircraft carriers that were in-service in 1998; the 2 that remain in-service today AND the now-planned 2 'big-deck' aircraft carriers is overt evidence of a political party that is either pathologically incapable or unwilling to make hard choices in terms of priorizing allocations of public monies....

https://www.military-today.com/navy/improved_nimitz_class.htm :

"... These (US Navy Nimitz class supercarriers) were completed with Kevlar armour over their vital areas and have improved hull protection arrangements...

"The Kevlar armour has been retrofitted to the earlier carriers, as have many of the advanced systems built into the newer ships..."

https://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/uss-theodore-roosevelt-headed-into-midlife-overhaul-02810/

https://www.news.navy.mil/navydata/fact_display.asp?cid=4200&tid=400&ct=4

https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/navy/lhd-8.htm

https://www.naval-technology.com/projects/cvn-21/

https://www.naval-technology.com/projects/cvn-21/cvn-213.html

https://www.naval-technology.com/projects/cvn-21/cvn-214.html

https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ship/cvn-78-specs.htm

https://www.defensetech.org/archives/003686.html :

"... The Hyuga... will carry an Aegis-type air defense system, with the U.S.-developed AN/SPY-1 multi-function radar; her principal "weapons" armament will be 64 advanced ESSM-type (anti airborne threat) missiles... "

"... She will also be fitted with two 20-mm Phalanx (radar guided) "Gatling" guns for close-in defense against anti-ship missiles, and she will have six tubes for anti-submarine torpedoes...."

https://defense-update.com/products/h/hyuga_250409.html -

"... Hyuga is equipped with 16 Mk41 VLS (Vertical Launch System) cells (each cell carries and can launch 4 ESSM-type missiles- rvl) for anti-aircraft and anti-ship missiles and accommodates two 20mm Phalanx (radar guided) anti-missile cannon and two triple 12.75-inch torpedo mounts for self defense...."

"MBDA'S SAAM-FR NAVAL AIR DEFENCE SYSTEM SUCCESSFULLY CARRIES OUT FIRST SALVO FIRING", 30_05-2005:

https://www.mbda-systems.com/mbda/site/ref/scripts/newsFO_complet.php?lang=IT&news_id=138
note:
(a) the above Aster-15 missile test firing was from France's Charles de Gaulle aircraft carrier; AND
(b) the UK's presently in-service aircraft carriers were stripped of their obsolescent 'Sea Dart' anti airborne threat (AAW) missile systems in the late 1990's; AND
(c) the UK Labour govt refused to fund a replacement AAW system to be fitted 1998-2010; AND
(d) in order to save money, the planned aircraft carriers won't have any anti airborne threat missile systems whatsoever...

https://www.navy.mil/local/lhd8/ -

https://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_display.asp?cid=4200&ct=4&tid=400 -

https://www.fas.org/programs/ssp/man/uswpns/navy/amphibiousassault/lhd1Wasp.html -

https://www.fas.org/programs/ssp/man/uswpns/navy/amphibiousassault/lha1tarawa.html -

https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ship/lhx.htm

https://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/uss-theodore-roosevelt-headed-into-midlife-overhaul-02810/

https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ship/cvn-78-specs.htm



_________________
Roderick V. Louis,
Vancouver, BC, Canada,

flicks [#35] "anyways sure gango will address."

This chap seems to have a rather odd/difficult learning style. I suspect he may just get a lot wrong in order to learn more and/or get attention.

- AIR POWER FROM THE SEA- THE CASE FOR EIGHT VANGUARD (TRIDENT) SUCCESSOR CLASS SUBMARINES -

The (Trident missile carrying) Vanguard successor class submarine programme provides a cogent example of a UK defence spending issue that- if done with ambition and a long-term strategic view- would provide the UK with hugely increased capabilities to project deterrence and prosecute conventional and irregular Warfare/counter-terrorism operations around the world...

And would have benefits for not only the UK but also its allies and trading partners world-wide...

Why build only 4 Vanguard successors?

At least 8 are needed...

And these new subs are needed to be 'full-sized', IE: 24-missile-tube vessels (similar to the US's Ohio class and Ohio successor class subs), instead of the strategically-foolish 12-missile-tube models 'decreed' by Labour last year:

https://www.janes.com/news/defence/naval/jmr/jmr090420_1_n.shtml

If 8 Vanguard successor class subs were built, 4 could be tasked with a (Trident successor) nuclear ballistic missile submarine (SSBN) role with the other 4 fitted as conventional-warhead, Land-attack (Tomahawk) cruise missile subs (SSGN's)...

Experiences of the US have shown that 'dual tasking' of this type of submarine can be very productively facilitated:

Between 2002-2008, 4 of the US Navy's 18 Ohio class Trident nuclear ballistic missile subs (SSBN's) were refitted, converting these subs into SSGN's...

22 of each Ohio sub's 24 Trident nuclear ballistic missile tubes were each fitted to accommodate and fire 7 conventional-warhead armed Land-attack (Tomahawk) cruise missiles, instead of their previous configuration allowing for 'only' one Trident II nuclear ballistic missile to be accommodated per tube...

As a result, each refitted Ohio can be armed with up to 154 Tomahawk Land-attack cruise missiles (each one carrying a 1000 pound warhead) as compared to the barely 1/2 a dozen* maximum number of Tomahawks that current Vanguards and entering-service/undergoing construction Astute SSN's can responsibly be armed with...

(* Astutes' maximum armament is 36 weapons, IE torpedoes and or Tomahawks...

(How many commanders or strategists would want to trade off more than 20% of an individual Astute's comparatively skimpy- but very likely to be needed in a naval-conflict situation- torpedo armament capacity for useless in a naval-conflict situation Tomahawks: missiles that can not be used in naval-theatre self defence and cannot be used against sea-based targets... )

The other 2 missile tubes on each refitted Ohio sub were converted to serve as lockout chambers for Special Forces personnel.

Each of these two missile tube chambers has been equipped to connect to an Advanced US Navy SEAL Delivery System (ASDS) or Dry Deck Shelter (DDS).

Other spaces on each sub have been converted to berth and support 66 Special Forces personnel.

As a result of their retrofits, for over 2-years the 4 refitted Ohio's have been usefully deployed as conventional warhead Tomahawk guided cruise missile-armed/special forces' units-carrying (SSGN) subs:

1) "The (US) Navy's Premiere Counterterrorism Tool":

https://www.informationdissemination.net/2008/10/navys-premiere-counterterrorism-tool.html

2) "Navy Trident Submarine Conversion (SSGN) Program: Background and Issues for Congress", October 02-2008:

Unlike other BBC web site blogs, the self-styled investigative Newsnight programme blog's censors regularly remove my submitted-comments' links to US Congressional Research Service military & defence programme documents...

- Or, regularly, the Newsnight blog censors refuse to post my comments entirely if they contain links to US Congressional Research Service military & defence programme documents...

... usually under the vacuous pretense that comments containing links to PDF format documents are prohibited on the Newsnight programme blogs...

So, rather than include a link with this comment to the PDF format US Congressional Research Service document:

"Navy Trident Submarine Conversion (SSGN) Program: Background and Issues for Congress", from October 02-2008,

instead, readers of this page can go to an HTML format page:

https://opencrs.com/

and then either:

A) type into this page's search box: "Navy Trident Submarine Conversion (SSGN) Program: Background and Issues for Congress", or

B) type the "Navy Trident Submarine Conversion (SSGN) Program: Background and Issues for Congress"report number- RS21007- into the search box... and then- among the search results- locate the report- and the version from October 02-2008...

3https://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/ssgn-tactical-trident-subs-special-forces-and-super-strike-01764/

8 Vanguard successors coupled with the 7 Astute attack subs (SSN's) very belatedly being built/undergoing sea trials for the Royal Navy would provide the country with force-projection capabilities that would legitimately give serious pause to known and potential state and non-state aggressors in the future and would at least partially make up for the egregious damages done to the RN's surface combatant strength and capabilities over the last 12-years...

Damages that won't in the least be rectified by the 6 Type-45 Destroyers and 2 aircraft carriers that Labour has begrudgingly committed highly inadequate funding for the construction of: these urgently needed warships are being built without basic, industry-standard weapons, sensors, communications, ship self-defence and damage control systems- apparently due to politically motivated design-interference: in order to save money...

Strategies for maintaining the UK's submarine- & other military vessel types & related technologies- innovation, design & construction capabilities several decades into the future should prominently factor into whatever decisions are made after May 06-2010 regarding the Trident renewal/Vanguard submarine successor issues...

Similarly, Trident renewal/Vanguard successor decision-making processes should be considering the UK's optimal global 'industrial, technological and military competence and capabilities' profiles and how whatever decisions are made will enormously effect these profiles...

Any country- such as the UK- with a better-part-of-2-centuries long history occupying leading positions on the world's most powerful and influential political, legal, trade, financial and military bodies needs to be seen to be structuring its military capabilities and high-tech/industrial competencies as though it intends to retain these positions...

If the UK builds- or becomes known to be intending to build- less than half the operationally-required numbers of an integral to national defence & 'world roles' class of military vessel- in this case submarines- during a 2-decade span- the UK can expect to be viewed by other countries as weak and ambitionless- possessing misguided and incompetent leadership, and not worthy of retaining its long-held positions of leadership on the world's most powerful and influential political, legal, trade, financial and military bodies...

Does the UK want to remain a valued and respected world player??



__________________
Roderick V. Louis,
Vancouver, BC, Canada

very scary milliband on daily politics foreign policy debate.

he wants more wars of liberal interventionism? in effect if labour get in we will have a war with iran?

they didn't ask the lib dems about their plan to join the euro? which is electoral suicide once the public get to hear of it.

38 Hawkeye_Pierce

'We do have a choice in how to handle the upcoming financial implosion.'

One of the best, most positive posts I've seen on here for a long time. You should also post it Paul Mason's blog.

However...

I thinks it's now too late for sensisible, pragmatic, logical posts. The situation is deteriorating too fast (see Portugal and illegal/subversive US banking practices)

Something/someone with decisive leadership qualities needs to take a grip and fast.

...and I don't think liberal democracies are capable of doing it.

#45 - its not independent ! Why do you think its being hammered ? My interest in gold and silver is only because of that. Although I did once have an interest in plating as pure silver as I could onto copper while researching an early photographic process, but found its not possible due to additives - brighteners and flateners which make the silver polish-able. 99.9999 pure silver is off white in colour and nodual. Silver when exposed to the vapours of iodine produces - silver iodide which is light sensitive. When also exposed to the vapours of bromine it increases the light sensitivity (accelerator) hence a photographic process was born - 1839 - Paris The Daguerreotype was made public. The same year that the Elkington brothers invented electro-silver plating - rather convenient or what. Edmond Becquerel found that light also develops daguerreotype plates as well as fogging but due to the fact that 'dag' plates are only really sensitive to light in the blue - ultraviolet end of the spectrum - light which is filtered to only red, allows the plate to be developed without fogging. The beginnings of my interest in silver.

Math is Statist is Jaded Jean; j'accuse!

Let's face it; both the Tweedleband boys are extremely scary, not just around the eyes or their permanent disdainful sneers; what they say is straight from the Tony's Insirational Tapes self-help series, or T.I.T.S.S. as it's known in the publishing business.

They will both re-submerge after the election and undergo more treatment from Tony and Mandy; Ted Tweedleband will become leader of Noolabour? - reflecting that transatlantic drawl and query of their guru - and Dave Tweedleband will be leader of the Noocons - not neocons, please note - a party setting out the Fourth Way as articulated by Archie Mandright aka Lord Blair of Sedgefield, Hampstead and Jerusalem.

jauntycyclist [#49] "very scary milliband on daily politics foreign policy debate."

Something about him is indeed very scary. Compare and contrast the Early Life with The Private Life sections here.

Does it make sense, or is it designed to appeal as a bundle of desirable characteristics which initially appear OK but make no real sense upon closer analysis, because real people just aren't like that. It's very much New Labour though. all appearance, all front.

New Labour brought this theatrical irreality into British life. Real life is not theatrics. Theatrics is just for entertainment. A distraction from real life. Misdirection.

flicks [#51] It is you know. We came off the Gold Standard long ago.

Furthermore, we've come off the emulsion standard too. It's all digital now.

Gold and silver are now just commodities. The rise in price has been an inflated bubble like oil etc. Talking people into gold is just like talking them into tulips, dotcoms and property.

The reason so many people are now behaving so badly is because they're lost. They're lost because they have no standards, no boundaries. They want standards and boundaries though. Politicians are letting them down promising them freedom. They can't give them that. They just deprive them of security and call that freedom!

kashibeyaz [#52] Who are you?

24. At 3:40pm on 19 Apr 2010, thegangofone wrote:
#11 debtjuggler

"Maybe Jewish hegemony in the Western liberal democracies is finally being exposed!"

As I have said many times in the past the far right with their talk of the "Jewish hegemony" are as likely to produce evidence to support their mental malaise as you are to see flying pigs barrel roll in salute to the BNP at their conference-in-a-field.

Your ridiculous notion for instance is seemingly based on the fact that some of the people involved have Jewish names.

----------------------------------------

What do you mean, they're all jewish!

Alan S. Rosenman
Frances R. Bermanzohn
John Alfred Paulson

Maybe you are confused by the surname Paulson...Many jews disguise their surnames to make them appear like WASP surnames...Paulson was born to Alfred Paulson (originally Paulsen).

https://wapedia.mobi/en/Talk:John_Paulson

I the last part of this quote from Wiki says it all...

'Paulson is #45 on the list of the world's wealthiest billionaires and is worth approximately $12 billion as of 2010. In April 2010, NY Times reported Paulson had earned $2.3 billion in 2009 & $2 billion in 2008 from fees received from his Hedge Fund Paulson & Co (He bet against sub prime mortgages long before the term became well known)'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Paulson

$19 Million Raised at Wall Street Dinner Honoring John A. Paulson and Marc S. Lipschultz
https://www.ujafedny.org/press-releases-2/view/19-million-raised-at-wall-street-dinner-honoring-john-a-paulson-and-marc-s-lipschultz

https://wapedia.mobi/en/Talk:John_Paulson

'Senior Goldman Exec Is Married to Former Head of ACA'
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/vicky-ward/senior-goldman-exec-is-ma_b_542154.html

The whole caper was probably cooked up at some NY bar mitzvah.

#54 - Just wait and see. I'm surprised you don't get it.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

#52

Kashibeyaz

I was the first to see through 'them' and said so sometime ago now

mim

debtjuggler @ 11

"Maybe Jewish hegemony in the Western liberal democracies is finally being exposed!"

I don't think there was any doubt about Jewish supremacy...the financial world is run by the Jews. Doesn't anybody do any research anymore. Who own the TV, print and news media?...Hollywood?...care to guess. My agent is Jewish, my accountant is Jewish. If I need a lawyer, he'll proberbly be Jewish. They own the banks, they own the corporations, they finance and operate the Presidents and prime ministers...this ain't some secret Knowledge.

43. At 7:29pm on 19 Apr 2010, flicks wrote:

#41 Have to say that is very funny.

-------------------------

It may be funny....but is it true?

Apply that question to everything you read on these blogs....and you will soon weed out the wheat from the chaff!

Name calling (especially involving the use of the the word fascist) is a real give-a-way.

Five white mainly middle aged men sit round the table and talk about politics. Could someone there be a little bit more imaginative please?

Hey!...he can’t be that bad then!

...it’s better than Satan worshipping!

Barack Obama plays eight times more golf than George W Bush
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/barackobama/7607947/Barack-Obama-plays-eight-times-more-golf-than-George-W-Bush.html

Now!...I wonder why?

England 'least patriotic' country
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/7608125/England-least-patriotic-country.html

Now could you imagine this attitude in my homeland...the
good ol' US of A?

With letters like this to The Times and posts like those from kevseywevsey and Debtjuggler, maybe a few more need to take their red pills before it's too late?

Having said that, there are far more blueys about, and I fear there always will be, as it isn't just a matter of pointing out the facts. If it were, education would work, and so would rehabilitation and therapy. Most people will tell you what they believe without radically questioning what they believe, and they'll do that, because they believe that's natural. The harsh truth is that good analysis really does hurt, as it offends the status quo. Most people therefore avoid it.

Why is your political panel so dull and right wing?
It reminds me of the BBC's disastrous American electoral coverage when America was voting for change and the BBC gave us a load of old white reactionaries topped by the ghastly John Bolton. Talk about out of touch.

You would scarecly guess non-white, young, nothern, female, gay or, more importantly, interesting people exist in this country! Danny Finklestein? zzzzzzzzzz.

Them white middle aged men.
Yeah, Can we have Germaine Greer and Geri Halliwell on to even-it-out a bit please.

#61 kevseywevsey

I don't (and hope you don't) underestimate the jewish ability.

Some of the most capable people I have ever met are jewish....and it has been a privelige to work with most of them. I have worked with some of them in the engineering sphere and some have been truely outstanding leaders. Engineering can be extremely difficult and not all jews work in finance. Though I believe a disproportionate number do. Trust me, there is not much money in engineering.

There is such a thing as chutzpah!...and I think th ejews have an unfair share of it....probably by genetics.

It's the un-abashed networking thing that gets me! I guess it's only 'human nature'. They revel in it and most-times rub our noses in it that really pisses me off (et al).

This genetic phenomena just merely needs to be understood and managed!

Excellent debate by Jeremy with President Grimsson et al on the ash cloud crisis. Also enjoyed Jeremy's discussion with Danny Finkelstein & Co on the state of the parties & Tim's report followed by on the couch with Jenny Diski :o)

@ Kevseywevsey #68 - Germaine Greer & Geri Halliwell? Rather have Katie Price & Kerry Katona instead! They are all car crash tv :p

FOLLOW THE MONEY (WHAT'S LEFT OF IT)

"And Paul Mason will be asking why Labour is the only party not proposing to do something on a national, sovereign scale about banking."

Fundamentally, J Gordon Brown is not very bright - note that Sarah 'monitors' him like a blundering puppy. If you find that hard to swallow, listen to his unscripted utterances. A puppy would blush.

Regarding Paul's query, above: Are we in 'Fool or Knave' territory, yet again? Even 'foolish knave'? Brown must surely have a 'reward job' lined up with some American Money House (quid pro quo for 'letting it rip' during his reign) and is he still thinking in terms of retiring into a money-lined nest - JUST LIKE TONY? If so, he will avoid doing anything that might put noses out of joint.

Brown will, of course, fend off the fact that 'THE (MONEY) WORLD HAS CHANGED - HAS IT NOT', with juvenile denial; for to be as great a god as Tony, is his 'PRECIOUS', and it consumes him like The Ring consumed Gollum.

Until we all get outside the lie of UK democracy, and focus on the sequential selections, and related criteria, that produce a Thatcher or a Blair or a Brown, these bizarrely motivated, unfit for purpose (management of Britain) individuals, will rise to power and behave like pantomime villains, at immeasurable cost to this nation. We CAN stop this. As a beginning, we must:

WRECK PARTY CHARADES

66. At 11:39pm on 19 Apr 2010, Math ap Mathonwy wrote:

With letters like this to The Times and posts like those from kevseywevsey and Debtjuggler, maybe a few more need to take their red pills before it's too late?

--------------------------

I must admit that the little blue pill has often stiffened my resolve with regard to the more verbally fluent opposition!

i.e stops them from talking ;o)

"What is the situation on the AfPak border and are we seeing more Pakistani activity in a cohesive way with the allies?"

pakistan is fighting the usa-india-uk part-sponsored insurgency on its territory.

"Is the "war on drugs" the primary way to cut Talib funds?"
no its funding is primarily external.

whats more interesting though is if anyone in the NN team will ask any of the party leaders why they would support israel over the palestinians peoples rights, why they would change british laws in order to serve israels interests .

ask why they would still hold onto the ludicrous idea that foreign policy is not the driving force towards radicalisation whilst all of the evidence points in that direction.

maybe someone might want to point out that the afghan war is illegal, unwinnable and why we would support - in fact aid in torture, and collude in the deaths of civilians in afghansitan whilst denying any such actions. (clive stafford smith has an interestingly revealing article in todays guardian)

of course NN might want to ask about israels nukes, its lack of commitment to the npt and lack of iaea inspections, maybe ask why we support the siege of gaza the abuse of palestinians in jerusalem and west bank and the war rhetoric of israelis against lebanon and syria.

maybe we could elicit the time table for the attack on iran regardless of the facts on the ground (ie no evidence of nuke bomb or nuke material being diverted).. now mooted to be between may and august.

somehow i doubt these questions will get any airing at all.

@flicks

Don't worry, I'm on the trail of the Andrew Maguire "hit", and the current Goldman investigation, even if the UK media is quashing any noticeable signs - except maybe for Will Hutton, see below:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/profile.shtml?userid=13633395

Curiously the Russian and Iranian tax payer gets far better value for money with Max Keiser than us limeys with the BBC. Also, check out the Bill Moyers interview with Simon Johnson - not gutsy, but solid respectable critique of the current circumstances - not "anti-finance" just "anti-corruption".

Just about to tuck in to Peter Warburton's "Debt and Delusion", here's a taster that made me order the book:

https://www.gata.org/node/8303

#52 "Math is Statist is Jaded Jean"

Spot on. The secret is in the behaviour. Anyone who studies behaviour will notice the similaries of, for instance:

- written style
- use of HTML A ref links
- Common themes
- Common enemies (esp. whipping boys, e.g. GO1)
- Frequency /pattern of blogging (e.g. multiple posts in a row)

If Charlie Epps were about, I'm sure he'd have a fancy mathematical behavioural analysis model which proves the case. In the meantime, I'll just have to second the "j'accuse"!

#60 update

Not only that, 'they' were on the bike tonight. You know, that one in the beige coat 'sporting' a moustache, a little like Stalin, Lenin, the Byelorussian President, Lech Walesa, etc, and the sex loving Borat, aka Sacha Cohen.

mim

The Liberals lost their place to Labour in the two party system between the wars in the C20th, when the country was governed by small majority governments or coalitions of two or more parties.

I think over the next decade at most. We’ll see the opposite happening the Liberals regaining their place in the two party system from Labour.

It's obvious there is not enough room for two Tory parties (Conservative and New Labour). The Tories that voted for New Labour will go back to the Conservative party, now Blair is no longer the leader of New Labour. All New Labour will be left with will be middle class socialists and thick working class people that think the New Labour are still champions of the proletariat.

63. At 11:07pm on 19 Apr 2010, redruth wrote:

Five white mainly middle aged men sit round the table and talk about politics. Could someone there be a little bit more imaginative please?

Dress them in drag ? After all, we like our pantomine !

LIBDEMS WILLFULLY BLIND TO EU CULTURES' REALITIES- & THE HUGE INTERNATIONAL DANGERS OF AN EU SUPERSTATE!!

It's plain that one of the biggest challenges for members of the UK Libdem party is acknowledging mainland-Europe's cultural and historical realities as they are, not willfully blindly seeing mainland-Europe, and by extension- the EU- as they would like it to be....

This would require an honest acknowledgment by prospective Libdem politicians, party members and others of:

1) What 'Europe's countries' peoples' unequivocally demonstrated for 800-years worst propensities are*; and are evidenced contemporarily**

2) The fact that the 'good Europe' (EU) of today COULD CHANGE TO A BAD EUROPE OVERNIGHT;

3) The fact that the likelihood and potential of today's 'good Europe' turning into a bad Europe increases with the greater integration and amalgamation of EU member nations into each other and within a 'superstate EU';

4) The fact that if EU member nations such as the UK lose their sovereignty and become part of a superstate EU, opposing the dominant culture (or maybe 2 cultures) that eventually control the majority of EU structures, bureaucratic and political posts, etc- and hence set the superstate's 'internal and/or foreign-policies and international MILITARY OBJECTIVES will not be possible...;

5) The fact that should the EU- as a 'superstate' of 600 million people- turn bad while the UK was irretrievably bound into it- the UK, its peoples and its politicians would have no effective recourse to oppose UK military and materiel resources being, in effect, hijacked for improper purposes...;

The US/UK 'special relationship', while not perfect, is at least a relationship between two sovereign states, with each country free to make its own decisions and set its own objectives on the world stage as it sees fit...

While it is true that closely bound histories along with common mercantile, legal, trade, democratic and global political principles and philosophies have often acted to encourage constructive alignment of UK and US endeavors world-wide since the end of WW II, the UK has always had a "national choice" of whether or not to participate in US geo-political objectives...

Although criticized by many, the recent Iraq and Afghanistan operations are good examples of the 'superstate' that is the US initiating international endeavors in which the UK participated- only after freely making a democratic decision to do so...

Should the UK be subsumed into a superstate EU, no such "free choice" would be available to the UK as to whether or not to participate in a superstate EU's global 'projects', endeavors and/or military fracas's...

The UK can best be enabled to continue doing good around the world- and to further its own reasonable interests- militarily or otherwise- as an independent nation continuing to work closely with the United States, British Commonwealth countries, the U.N., and NATO...

These objectives are not conflicted by the UK as a member of a multi-speed, non-superstate EU (IE: an aligned-to-varying degrees economically, politically and in internal legal & social-policy ways group of nations)...

But removing all one's (the UK's) chips from an 'international bank' (UK sovereignty on the world stage) that has served one- the UK- well for centuries and putting these chips into a "very troubled history 'bank'" (European Continent) which has a centuries-long, uncontradicted track record of internal malfeasance and board-room bust ups- would only be recommended by the most intellectually dishonest and dangerously naive...

* Ego driven militarism; religious intolerance; persecution of minorities; never-ending wars; overseas land & property theft and subjugation of overseas peoples for the benefit of 'Europe's' country's peoples...

** Think the Balkans early 1990's- 2010

__________________
Roderick V. Louis,
Vancouver, BC, Canada

#76 'J'ACCUSE'

And I'll third and fourth it.

I have a couple of reasons for it.

mim

#81 update

Heads will roll whatever the outcome. It may be at the cost of my own 'happiness', health or even life but I'm of Socrates' and Seneca's ilk although jaded_jean's/statist's/math's 'pleasures' are certainly not worth such a sacrifice.

mim

HERO'S OR VILLAINS??

One of many stories of travellers trying to get home include proud boasts of "20 hours drive there and 20 hour drive back with just 4 hours sleep in between"

Should we give them a medal, or lock them up as a menace to the public?

Ideally it should be a defining day today. Not so much in mapping out the future, as it is a big unknown for anybody still alive, but in the change of tactics in dealing with 'Borat'.

mim

#84

That's a complicated question, BYT. I think I'll enjoy the beautiful day rather than spend much time worrying about coming up with a sensible answer to it.

However, while soaking up the sun, looking at all the budding and blossoming trees, flowers and kiddies enjoying themselves I shall be contemplating ways of how to steer the right people, and I don't necessarily mean the Tories, towards sorting out 'Borat'.

Hope you have a good day, Brightyangthing

mim

#85
Hope you do indeed enjoy all of the above Mim. Here, snowing, windy, chest infection and still trying to get son home from Southern Ireland have all conspired to make my day perhaps less pleasurable.

barriesingleton [#72] "Until we all get outside the lie of UK democracy, and focus on the sequential selections, and related criteria, that produce a Thatcher or a Blair or a Brown, these bizarrely motivated, unfit for purpose (management of Britain) individuals, will rise to power and behave like pantomime villains, at immeasurable cost to this nation. We CAN stop this. As a beginning, we must:

WRECK PARTY CHARADES"

Excellent advice, but the British way is to ignore bad behaviour hoping it will go away. The people who have orchestrated this pantomime and given the UK a diet of sex, drugs, rock and roll, and most recently fear by the bucket load, sadly know this, and will just continue fielding public relations thespians whilst further undermining the integrity of this nation using immigration, anti-nationalism, lowering standards, foreign wars against nationalists, more choice (a euphemism for privatisation), more change (uncertainty/anxiety and bad behaviour/crime) in fact anything which will weaken Britain as a nation. The term UK looks more and more odd these days doesn't it? Even the BBC maps of the country show it broken up into Regional Development Agencies you'll note.

So wrecking may not be the answer, as that may just help them do more of what they have been doing. What we need is more cooperation. More commonality. More compliance - nationalism and nationalization. The opposite of what is being done to this country.

I note that this blog has lots of name-calling trouble-makers. Are these political activists or just fielded U.Is to disrupt the blog?

Hawkeye_Pierce [#76] Let me ask you a few heuristic/rehtorical questions. Is everyone in the Labour Party/Conservative/Lib-Dem the same person? Is every cow in a herd the same cow? Is every apple on a tree the same fruit? Is every dog in the class 'dog' the same animal? Are people who share the same language, theory or belief set the same? What do we mean by 'same' and 'different'? What do we mean by identity? Are all people the same or are they different? Are some people the same, and if so, what do we mean by 'some'? Who is Hawkeye_Pierce and does anyone in this forum want to know? Should anyone want to know? What is knowing anyway? What function does 'it' actually serve in practice?

...WikiLeaks has released a classified US military video depicting the indiscriminate slaying of over a dozen people in the Iraqi suburb of New Baghdad -- including two Reuters news staff. Reuters has been trying to obtain the video through the Freedom of Information Act, without success since the time of the attack. The video, shot from an Apache helicopter gun-site, clearly shows the unprovoked slaying of a wounded Reuters employee and his rescuers. Two young children involved in the rescue were also seriously wounded...

https://wikileaks.org/

file under 'why do they hate us'

Katla:

"The eruption of this nearby long-dormant volcano in March and April 2010 prompted fears among some geophysicists that it might trigger an eruption at the larger and more dangerous Katla. In the past, all three known eruptions of Eyjafjallajökull triggered subsequent Katla eruptions."

Mr Grimsson was quite interesting last night, and whilst the Presidential position is largely ceremonial/PR as in China, he was once Minister of Finacnce in the 90s and is trained in political science and economics. Iceland is allegedly looking for new friends beyond Europe although Russia was not intersted in the site of the USA base allegedly.

Interestingly, Iceland's PISA data for males vs females has been a bit odd in recnet times, especially in 2003, where a highly atypical (for humans anywhere) female advantage in maths seemed to be restricted to rurual areas. Remember, Iceland only has a population of 300,000, which means it's entire population at 15 years of age (PISA group) would only be about 3000 pupils, and PISA only samples from a population. Small samples usually means more likelihood of sampling error. Iceland's pattern was atypical of world wide data. Why?

This set me wondering a long while back as to how Iceland ever got itself into such a banking mess given its welfare state and Lutheran traditions. Its population is little larger than large London borough is now projected to be in 30 years time remember. How was Iceland seduced by the Wall Street model? When and why did it happen?

One thing to note is that shortly after Mr Grimsson remarried in 2000 the banks were regulated in 2001 and teh first PISA run was in 2000 too. Iceland has recently been given a 'loan' by the IMF, and as one should know, the IMF's loans have strings - usually insisting that state assets are sold off.

Beware of lenders bearing gifts. Choose your 'friends' carefully.

jauntycyclist [#89] Didn't you or someone else post links to that a couple of weeks ago? The problem with the video is that one doesn't know whether this was meant to be a cleared area, i.e that nobody should have been around. The copter radio traffic referred to it as a 'battle' at one point. The gunship asked for permission to fire from control. Did the Reuters reporters have permission to be in the zone or were they chancing it?

One has to be prepared to hear the other side too, I suggest. I was left undecided after watching the clip.

#86

I'll try to blow some Spring's awakenings in your direction, BYT , in the hope of making you feel slightly better at least.

When I talked about 'the right people' I didn't necessarily mean all the presenters or guests sitting or standing on the right in Newsnight's studio, neither.

mim

MOST OF YOU KNOW A BIT ABOUT MARRIAGE - DON'T YOU?

Were there not aspects of the person you bound yourself to, OF WHICH YOU SUSPECTED NOTHING BEFOREHAND? Prime Ministers are similar.

Our bogus democracy is a (thinly disguised) stealth-presidency. Whether we vote-in an individual, or a pair of them, to have near-absolute power once installed, the thing to ponder is WHAT HIDDEN DELUSIONS AND NEEDS lurk in those psyche-basements? With hindsight, even those dazzled by Blair-glare now realize he is barking. Half a look at/listen to Brown, and his breathtaking denial of past error, is apparent. WHAT NEXT?

IT WAS A COLLUSION (COALITION) of Blair and IDS that launched us into undemocratic war (take a look st the voting figures). There's the precedent. IDS had a 'warrior hero' as a dad - was he trying to get a bit of warrior hero for himself? He does come over a rather soft by nature.

Why should two extreme distillations of the Westminster Ethos (a double presidency) be any more representative OF US than one individual? WHAT IF THEY FORM A WACKY AFFINITY - Bonnie and Clyde? Both Maggie and Blair had wacky affinities (not to mention Wilson) with aides. It's a small step.

Put not your trust in coalitions. NOTHING that springs from the Westminster paradigm will yield good leadership, good democracy or good management of Britain.

AVOID COALITION DREAMS

barriesingleton [#93] Whilst I'm sure you're basically right, as you might have detected from the tone of my post in #66, given the comments in the links, I fear that given the planned current absence of structure and discipline in this 'nation', the problem we now face is somewhat akin to that of trying to herd cats. This is why, I suggest, our stand-up-politicians all seem so very peculiar.

This election is a stifled tragic commedy upstaged by a volcano!

'or lock them up as a menace to the public?'

#83 Yes I saw that as well - note worthy that it was a black women married to a UK white man and he travelled for 20 hours to get her, yet all you can think about is him being locked up "ostensibly" in your mind, for being a menace to the public due to 4 hours sleep. Just to put it into context in the land of the far right.

You really are inferenced through with repulsion intent on subverting a malfunctioning mind.

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8631722.stm

laughable again in view of :-

https://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/better_regulation_action_plan.htm

Why not call for an investigation into his own stupidity which set the culture/breeding ground for incentivised destruction and out right criminal fraud on a massive scale?

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Clegg won't Nick it!

He hasn't been groomed by Bilderberg.

Expect some dirt to be dished out/exposed soon.

flicks [#95] "Yes I saw that as well - note worthy that it was a black women married to a UK white man and he travelled for 20 hours to get her, yet all you can think about is him being locked up "ostensibly" in your mind, for being a menace to the public due to 4 hours sleep. Just to put it into context in the land of the far right.

You really are inferenced through with repulsion intent on subverting a malfunctioning mind."

Let me ask you a straight question in order, hopefully, to make a point which I think you need to take on board.

In the above, you have made an assertion about what someone else allegedly 'thinks'. Note, that it is you who has ascribed this 'thought'. There is no evidence that the person you ascribe it to holds this view. Thus, there is no way that said person can refute it. This is all too commonly done, and usually without awareness. People confuse what they 'think' with what others 'think'. A possibilityt occurs to them, they think it bad, assert they never thought it, feel guilty, then assert someone else must think it, and attack them! This behaviour actually provokes frustration, resentment and anger in others for this very reason. It is in fact slightly paranoid class of behaviour. Can you see that? It is just a dramatic creation.

What does this tell one about the entire process of ascription? What does this tell one about the aberrant nature of human 'psychology' in fact? It may surprise you to know that good psychologists study this peculiar behaviour as a phenomenon, i.e just as a behaviour, without asserting that it is rational. They just know that it happens, and are intrigued as to how and why it happens.

I'm trying to be helpful and informative here, not punitive. I can tell by the way that you write that you probably don't know this, as those who do know this don't write the way that you do about these matters. Do you see how I am trying to be helpful?

ash

using met office models? oh dear.

sounds like it was the blame claim compo culture decision?