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| TX: 19.12.08 - Remploy PRESENTER: PETER WHITE |
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| Downloaded from www.bbc.co.uk/radio4 THE ATTACHED TRANSCRIPT WAS TYPED FROM A RECORDING AND NOT COPIED FROM AN ORIGINAL SCRIPT. BECAUSE OF THE RISK OF MISHEARING AND THE DIFFICULTY IN SOME CASES OF IDENTIFYING INDIVIDUAL SPEAKERS, THE BBC CANNOT VOUCH FOR ITS COMPLETE ACCURACY. WHITE When Remploy was founded just after the Second World War it seemed an entirely appropriate response which would provide sheltered employment to thousands of disabled ex-servicemen. But times have changed - disabled people now expect the chance to work in open industry and an annual subsidy of £20,000 for each worker is less politically acceptable than it once was. Last year Remploy made the controversial decision to close 43 out of 83 factories, reducing that to 29 after vigorous union opposition. But it's in this climate that Remploy has appointed Tim Matthews as its new chief executive. He's run an NHS trust, the Highways Agency and he's worked in senior positions in an engineering company. So how does this role fit with the other positions he's held? MATTHEWS I think in lots of ways it's a natural culmination of the CV. It's a great role to be leading an organisation which has got such a wonderful record of supporting people with disabilities. We currently employ just under 3,000 people through our factory network. This year alone we'll place in excess of 7,000 people into employment and that number will rise to 20,000 a year over the next four years. WHITE But you join at quite a controversial moment, I mean the basic problem that people see about Remploy is this figure of around £20,000 which it is said is necessary to support each person in a Remploy factor, the plan is to get that down to 10,000 - is that really a practical plan and in some ways is that enough, shouldn't they be self sufficient? MATTHEWS Well I think it is a practical plan. In part because we are organising our factory businesses now into a smaller number of much more commercially focused and much more commercially viable businesses. Our aim is to get them down, as you said, to a subsidy which is no more than 10 or so thousand. WHITE Given what's often said about disabled people, for example in the high street sectors that you're operating now it's said that disabled employees, if anything, have a less than average sickness, absence rate and a more than average productivity rate. In that case why can't these factories be run at least running even? MATTHEWS Well and that would be our aim. An increasing part of our focus is to support people moving from worklessness or from benefits into mainstream employment. WHITE Does that mean that the factory model may be at some level has been accepted as not viable, I mean you've closed a number of factories and you seem to be suggesting that the way forward really is to get people into open industry? MATTHEWS And I think that is broadly accepted both in the political world and in the wider disability world, that doesn't mean there isn't and won't be a place in the future for sheltered employment in some form. But no I mean the main emphasise of our work is to ensure that they can use their skills and abilities in the mainstream workforce. WHITE So will there be more closures? MATTHEWS We're not proposing anymore closures at this stage. Clearly Remploy is not, as a commercial organisation, isn't immune from the current economic downturn and we are - we're having to look at ways in which we can manage our factories as best we can. WHITE And of course the recession that is going to affect getting people into open employment as well, when there are so many people without disabilities who desperately need jobs too. MATTHEWS It's going to be challenging to get anybody or it's going to be equally challenging I think to get people into work. But having said that the record shows that employers who do make the right provision and employ people with disabilities find that they take on very good people with very good skills and their sickness rates tend to be lower and their absenteeism tends to be lower. WHITE The government has repeatedly said for the last 10 years or so it wants to get a million disabled people back to work, that's a pretty ambitious aim, what do you see as Remploy's role in that and is it a realistic aim? MATTHEWS I don't know whether it's a realistic figure or not, all I can say is Remploy has a very important role to play in that. We have developed a model, both of working with disabled people but also importantly with the employers so that we can bring the two together and create sustainable jobs for disabled people. WHITE I mean you're being a bit cautious here, I mean do you have plans that you're not telling me about then because surely something fairly radical has to be done if we're going to shut down some of the factories and we're going to get large numbers of people into work in these economic conditions you're going to have do something pretty radical aren't you? MATTHEWS We're already doing something pretty radical as I've said, how we're doing that is both by focusing on the individuals - what their personal and particular barriers to accessing work are; but also, as important, working with an increasingly wide range of employers to ensure that they have the ability to take on people. WHITE If you had a clean slate and you've always come in with a given situation and there's a lot of history, if you had a clean slate what would you do? MATTHEWS Very few people would start from where - from the hand they're dealt. But I don't think we would now invent the model of sheltered employment. We are where we are but increasingly, as I said, to ensure that we are supporting more and more people into mainstream employment, that's what people want. WHITE So you do see the sheltered model carrying on for the foreseeable future, because the argument is that there are many people who that's all they've known and to go out into an open environment maybe in your mid-40s, early 50s is a pretty tough thing to do? MATTHEWS And it is certainly - certainly has been challenging for a number of people who have left our factories over the last year. But I think looking forward is that a model that one wants to replicate or increase for people with disabilities coming new to the labour market? I think probably on the whole not. WHITE Remploy's new chief executive Tim Matthews. Back to the You and Yours homepage The BBC is not responsible for external websites |
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