Not everyone's a fan

Finally Nick, some balanced reporting (apart from the "ouch" which makes it seem you are pro Brown)

Gordon Brown is no superhero

Remember the 10p fiasco

I hope you haven't forgotten as the electorate has not!!

WOW - they go to say......

"We would have thought the far more urgent task is to assess and correct the mistakes that were made by various national regulators. Or for that matter, to reflect on the ways in which global financial regulators themselves contributed to the current mess."

Very interesting....
Is this the begining of the end for Gordo?

DC must surely pick up on this....

Gordon Brown got the UK into the position of being worse placed in the G7 if not G20.

Gordon Brown is more interested in geating the "Political Credit" for something than actually doing something in the national interest.

Recently Gordon brown has taken in the last month to saying that he would cut taxes and increase public spending through borrowing to gain a short-term political point. The effect is that Sterling is collapsing, which means overseas investors are unlikely to fund borrowing, which means measures to limit the "Brown Recession" are not enacted.

Gordon Brown is a liability to this country, he will even try making a babies death a political point to gain political capital.

Gordon Brown is a monster, for those who say he is well intentioned. We should look to Hitler in Germany, he was well intentioned and look at what happened in that country.

Delete Ouch, insert HA!

Delete Ouch insert "YOU DON'T SAY?!?!?"

Delete ouch and insert "here here"

Delete Brown insert Cameron

Obviously Nick's propaganda has not spread to Wall Street - there is still some balanced comment out there.

I SO agree with the Wall St Journal!

Talk about having you cake and eating it. On the one hand the government is not guilty of causing the crisis and did not see it coming apparently until Lehman Brothers. Now they are coming up with "solutions" when there does not seem to be a coherent analysis of what went wrong in the first place.

THE lesson of 10 years of Japanese stagflation was apparently that they needed to really make sure the public were fully informed so that confidence would return. Otherwise recession becomes a self fulfilling prophecy and may extend beyond the 1-2 years projected (by the people who did not see it coming).

So a UK politician behaving like an amateur magician who will pull a rabbit out of a hat just won't cut it.

We should have kept our powder dry until there was a public inquiry on what really happened. Who knew what and when and what did they do? Why did nobody in authority see this coming? Why won't this happen again?

As ever its not the people at the top who will feel this impact - unless Gordon has not appreciated the long term "blow back" and calls a snap election.

The global economic hero. I think JM Keynes crown may be safe for a while yet.

Nick why dont you just blog like Justin Webb and put both sides of the argument. All your blogs are pro Brown, and even the anti-Brown blogs contain some sympathy for Brown from yourself like "ouch"

Gordon Brown is the problem, not the solution. It is time for brown to go, he is not upto the post of PM and is costing this country Jobs as he tries to gain political points off Britains economic future and gains neither.


Message to the PLP - Remove Gordon for the sake of the country, if you think like Brown - then please do it for your party. Gordon Brown is a monster, who shows that political point scoring his is main function in No.10.

#2 goldtrebor

DC may pick up on it but if he is wise I think there is only so much hay that could be made from it.

Would he have done anything that much different from Brown before Lehman Brothers?

Hopefully they will all learn their lessons and we will get a stabler economic strategy than the "Russian Roulette" approach as exemplified by Credit Default Swaps.

Nick Robinson is so much a Tory, I wonder why he doesn't stand for parliament! His comments on bbc news programmes are so bias and one sided I am suprised he doesn't move to Sky News where he would find like minded people.

I completely agree with that comment in the editorial.

Sensible , reassuring policy - Yes please.

Spending spree, more borrowing - No thanks.

But we do still need to reform the international financial system though.
That's part of the sensible, reassuring policy...

Gordon Brown has dreadful judgement.

Brown who boasts of No more Boom and Bust for short term political capital should not be trusted on international Financial issues.

Brown has no global credibility - would they really take advice from a country where the Leader (Brown) has the worse performing economy in recession in the G7 if not the G20.

Gordon Brown needs removing from No.10 he is not fit to be PM.

seriously, why are the only bloggers on any of nick robinsons articles, tories apparently looking for some reason to seuggest some terribly overt bias in favour of Labour and Brown??
Even when he criticises Brown u suggest hes biased in favour of Brown, and when he points out any possible successes (as highlighted by Krugman, who won a nobel prize in economics) it is howled at as if its a party political broadcast and everyone just spouts out the last thing they heard David Cameron say!!!

You could have quoted this line from the WSJ' Editorial too:

"The better message for this summit should be -- politician, heal thyself."

For me, Brown is a sickening politician. The BBC does its fair share of boosting him. Always showing on the news short clips of trite statements made by him at various summits, as if they were holy writ.

The WSJ also mentions that Spain was not invited to the meeting, even though it was the only country to have created a financial cushion for the banks before the crisis.

Meanwhile, sterling is collapsing against the dollar and the euro, thanks to Brown's actions. Its really time we got shot of him.

See, Robinson?
Countries in which the media don't have their fingers bent back by Campbell and Baron Mandelson can enjoy reading honest appraisals and "damning verdicts".
Lovely, huh?

What a tragedy that it has taken an American newspaper to spot that there are no details attached to Gordon Brown's save the world plans.

Repeatedly Gordon Brown has been caught out with baosts, hyperbole and rhetoric and repeatedly he returns to the same well worn script.

He hasn't got a clue how to save the world and the Americans are right to say that the way is not smashing capitalism and raising government spending.

We need to cut taxes dramatically, business and VAT and a radical audit of non essential public services needs to take place and some hard decisions taken; no more diversity officers for a kick off.

There has been waste on a monumental scale; just as the private sector is being shut down where there is waste so should the public sector. You can't have a global economic downturn and expect only the private sector to take the pain - it pays for the public sector.

The BBC should learn that charity begins at home; get ridof Jonathan Ross for good; axe the myriad special advisor on the NEws and just return to reading it out.

The Glenrothes bounce is already fading - no American is about to allow Gordon Brown to take the credit for anyhting except the debt fuelled boom he engineered.

Call an election

Although I have said many times before that Nick is biased towards the Government..I have to come to his support here.

The "ouch" can't really be seen as supportive of Brown..it does,however,suggest that Nick thinks it may have hurt him.

You can make of that anything you like.

Re: 16
I'm not Tory,

or Labour, or Lib Dem

I'm neutral, a floating voter with no party allegiance...

I'll vote for whoever makes most sense. Some things GB and Darling do make sense. Some things DC and Osborne do make sense. I'm happy to give credit where its due and criticise where its appropriate...

I think many of the comments relating to Nick's alleged biased analysis are getting silly. I don't think some posters will be happy until the beeb apoint Simon Heffer as political editor.

As for the topic, I am far from convinced about Cameron and the 'New' tories, and George Osborne seems very lightweight. However I do agree that the Labour have allowed debt to get out of hand, and the prospect of yet more to fund tax cuts - instead of looking to make at least some savings elsewhere - does not fill me with confidence.

While a global strategy to fight the downturn is neccessary - you can't help but think that this has as much to do with saving Gordon's bacon, as with saving the world economy. It has to be said that Her Majesty's oppostion haven't exactly been on the ball through all this - Cameron aside, the rest of his merry band have seemed like rabbits caught in the headlights. Bring in Ken Clarke!

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Nick Robinson:
Paul Krugman is not a fan of Gordon Brown, that is sad and upsetting....

Nick,

there was an economic crisis just after WWI, the very early twenties. The solution was to say to hell with asset values, let them fall.

When the crisis of the late twenties first materialised in 1928 they pumped money in to protect asset values. What happened they blew the money and when in 1929 the Stock markets fell again they were the sympton of the malais, production levels and wages could not be maintained. Was it not Churchill who mistakenly took us back on to the Gold Standard and set an appallingly high exchange rate.

Now we have the reverse, the Gold is nearly all gone, the exchange seems to have no floor, money is being pumped in to preserve asset values, and failing, and manufacturing is not going to manufacture if the price paid is less than the year before.

The only solution is to reduce the cost of production by a combination of reducing staff numbers and lowering the wages of those who remain. Nobody sells goods for very long where the cost of production is actually higher than the proceeds of sale. The answer is not to throw money at it.

The British government has defaulted on its debts in the past, I thought that the redemption date for War loan was 1928/9 only there was no money so they made it an irredeemable stock, it is of course still a gilt.

As for reducing wages just look at the Invergordon Mutiny, that is when the world knew that the game was up with the British economy, I mean a naval mutiny.

Keynesian economics is not the answer, he was more famous for being gay and the treatment of Germany after WWI over war guilt and reparations.

Re 12 – thegangofone

The point is – we need to move forward so DC might say – at the next PQM –

“Does the right honourable gentleman not agree that the time has come to stop flying around the world to save the planet. Surely, it would be much better for him to remain here and solve the problems this country faces. Problems that he himself has created through 11 years of irresponsible government”…

I am sure DC would phrase it much better…

GB’s reply anyone !!!

Why can't Brown just be honest?

Tell the people of the UK that we've been living beyond our means for the past decade and that we will all have to make sacrifices in order to pay all this borrowed money back?

He can even blame the yanks and the banks if he wants to avoid reference to his own part in the mess.

What's so terrible about that? The shrinking GDP figures and retail numbers show that we've already begun the process ourselves anyway. What's to be gained by printing our way through this mess?

It won't make it go away. It ain't going to 'kiss it better'.

We've had the party. Hellooooo hangover.

Why do politicians treat us all like children? Shielding us from the truth about what's going on out there in the big bad world. We're not daft. Well, most of us aren't.

This would all be over much quicker and much more safely in terms of any even more disastrous policies that GB might adopt to 'fix' the situation if we just came to terms with the truth.

The truth is we've already spent the next five years holiday money. We'll just have to tighten our belt for a while and pay off our debts. No exotic holidays, make do with an older car for longer, less take-away Pizzas, but it's not all bad news - cheaper houses.

It's not rocket science.

Brown can't admit as much because he's completely implicated in the borrowing binge but it's time for Cameron to tell us the truth. Then, if he gets knocked back in 2009 or 2010 by the electorate we will know for sure that the voters are children who really do have to be shielded from the truth and the consequences of their actions. Then the smart ones can leave the kids to it and get the hell out.

Tories can blast Labour as much as they like, and some folks who aren't Tories may have some reservations. But, the important thing is the government continues to focus on facilitating success and show they're on people's side in this testing period.

As for the Washington Post, they're just bitching because they don't want to embrace change and want the world to kiss their ass. Will Obama sell out to yesterdays newspaper, or play a role in writing a new agenda into history? Time will tell.

Stop the presses:

A business-friendly newspaper owned by Rupert Murdoch attacks Brown (and by association Obama) for having the bad judgement to say that anyone other than financial firms should enjoy any bail-out from the state.

Wall Street Journal

Typical BBS bias attacking Gordon Brown and the government!
(Sorry Nick, I couldn't resist it!)

Nick

The title 'Not everyone's a fan' suggests that a lot of people are fans and that you are somewhat taken aback by the negative article in the Wall Street journal.

I have news for you, everyone I speak to knows that big ears is about as useful as a barber shop on the steps of the guillotine and that he's only swanning off round the world to avoid the pasting he gets at home.

How anyone can take this idiot seriously is beyond me.

Sorry but there is a definite sympathy towards Brown.

A few weeks ago Newsnight was interviewing a french minister and labouring the point about the Brown package leading the way and the rest of Europe following.

The french minister smiled enigmatically and said words to the effect if that's the way you want to play it for your domestic politics that's fine but the rest of Europe did not see it that way.

It is the lack of balance that is galling.

It's hardly surprising that the merkins aren't impressed with him - it's not like there's many over here that are either.

What Brown is doing is good Politics though not good Economics. Infact he should be respected as a good Politician in that the goal is to get and maintain a position of power.

Nick is the first to acknowledge Brown's skills and some have interpreted this as being pro-Labour. I think this interpretation is wrong: Nick is one of the best 'neutral' commentators out there (though not quite as good as Peter Oborne).

Re: 22 first sentence.

Yes.

But I will concede that the famous "Have you got blood on your hands Prime Minister?" question still sticks in my mind. Loaded and below the belt...

If ever there was a question one wished one hadn't asked, I bet that is it. But it was a jolly good question at the time though, as we were all asking it sat in front of our TV screens....

Who'd be a Reporter....

Nick,

when will people realise that the rest of the world are not as stupid as Gordon seems to think they are.

We have pummelled our exchange rates. The only way to survive is to produce goods for sale abroad, against the competition of the other countries own internal markets. So we expect foreigners to buy our goods whilst the local economy is being ruined and their own workers are being laid off.

We are going into a period of world isolationism again, it is the job of all governments to protect their own, that is their role, national security. So, Brown is stupid if he thinks that to go for British jobs for British workers, as he has said in the past, is not going to be the mantra of other countries, American jobs for Americans, Indian jobs for Indians etc...

Krugman said in the interview that Gordon Browns medicine was the right one for the US - but if I recall he declined to answer if it was also right for the UK.
IF Brown wants to expand spending by borrowing at the same time I think we will need to show and under what criteria he will subsequently raise taxes or cut spending to bring us back into balanced budget - if he does not do this then I think people will sell sterling as fast as they can.
Brown may well get us out of this current mess but he is laying the foundations of an even bigger mess if he does not show this end game detail. Why ? because no other country in the G20 has a budget deficit like ours and if this does not happen then I'm afraid that I'll see this as a stunt to deflect attention away from the mess he helped create

It should be of great concern to everyone in this country that Brown is going to sanction open ended spending - money that will likely be funneled into daft channels. I have heard absolute first hand horror stories about Labour and the NHS almost blackmailing GP's into accepting pre-signed contracts for millions over what they should be paying. The country is run by spivs and scammers and more of this governments spending will only expand such unethical spending.

It is a sad state for Joe Public... plumbers and all!

seriously, why are the only bloggers on any of nick robinsons articles, tories apparently looking for some reason to seuggest some terribly overt bias in favour of Labour and Brown??
Even when he criticises Brown u suggest hes biased in favour of Brown, and when he points out any possible successes (as highlighted by Krugman, who won a nobel prize in economics) it is howled at as if its a party political broadcast and everyone just spouts out the last thing they heard David Cameron say!!!

Right,thats it Nick,you can expect you dissmissal notice forthwith.
Whats more we are suspending your Nu Labour membership at once.
I hope you will pass on to the rest of your fellow travellers that WE will not tolerate even the mildest critcism from OUR broadcasting and propoganda arm

Jethro Newlab

Obviously Brown won't get many warm fuzzies from the US for the next few months. They just elected a new set of policies, and Brown is still singing from the old hymn sheet.

Whether GB was or is right or wrong is irrelevant (though I struggle to think of anything that Brown has done right in the last 10 years). We are talking about politics here, not evidence-based logical reasoning.

Re: 34
".. he should be respected as a good politician in that the goal is to get an maintain a position of power."

I completely agree.

But that same statement also sums-up what is wrong with our democracy.

Perfectly...

Having had a post on yesterdays thread removed as it contained a 'naughty' word lets try again:

"Any truth in this Nick?

Quote: BBC Journalist...

"Nick Robinson is now known by the nickname "Toenails" here at the Beeb because he's so far up Brown's [derriere] that that's all you can see of him."

Looks like your fellow BBC journo's think you might have a slight bias in a particular direction...

Surely not... ."

But, any excuse to talk up or high-five anything positive about their chosen product is seized on like an alchoholic returning to the whiskey.

Surely a more apposite analogy would be Gordon Brown borrowing more money. Hic.

The world's self-appointed economic messiah has arrived in the US hailing global tax cuts as salvation to our economic woes.

Maybe the fact that the current US administration have already cut taxes heavily is probably why Gordon is rubbing them up the wrong way.

Especially a 'messiah' that thinks a tax cut is taking money from the poor to give to the richer, in the case of Brown's 10% tax rate farrago.

You couldn't make this up. Really.

Is Wall Street Journal seeking to suggest that Gordon might be seeking to "grab the limelight" with the motive of "improving hs ratings"?

Surely not?

More breaking news - the Emperor has no clothes.

Glad to see some balance returning.

For those who see the addition of an ouch as bias - get a grip!

There has been a left leaning bias recently - but hopefully even the Beeb is capable of recognising when enough is enough.

To the subject of the blog. Any economists on here who can explain how we spend our way out of a Global recession, as our leader likes to define it.

Borrowers need lenders - don't they? So if it's Global - who are the lenders?

The alternative, as far as I can see, is to print new money even though the Country's asset values are falling. This is bad for the exchange rate - I think the markets have woken up to this as far as UK plc is concerned. If you wish to examine an extreme example of printing money against falling Country asset values - go no further than Zimbabwe.

So I think the Wall Street Journal has a point. Although I don't see any suggested alternative solutions in the article.

I believe that the Conservaties are right to focus on tax breaks for Companies to try to keep employment levels as high as possible. There is no point offering tax breaks to individuals if they are out of work.

And people in work contribute to the tax take, people out of work reduce the tax take and also draw down tax contributions as benefits - a double whammy and very bad for Government debt levels.

But I also see the point of bringing forward scheduled government capital programmes to keep money flows as high as possible, provided they are genuine programmes and over the term expenditures are a wash.

Any economists out there?

I would urge everyone to read the article. I think laid back American irony best describes the writing style as it refers to "That G20 Show" laconically.

https://online.wsj.com/article/SB122662346962726733.html

I like this bit "at laest they remembered to invite the Brazilians and Saudis this time". this summit is seen very much as an end of term show for Bush, and just another photo opportunity.

Effectively we have been misled into thinking that this is a big deal, as part of the long running soap entitled "Gordon saves the world again!". I guess GBs bluff has well and truly been called!

"There are four ways in which you can spend money. You can spend your own money on yourself. When you do that, why then you really watch out what you’re doing, and you try to get the most for your money. Then you can spend your own money on somebody else. For example, I buy a birthday present for someone. Well, then I’m not so careful about the content of the present, but I’m very careful about the cost. Then, I can spend somebody else’s money on myself. And if I spend somebody else’s money on myself, then I’m sure going to have a good lunch! Finally, I can spend somebody else’s money on somebody else. And if I spend somebody else’s money on somebody else, I’m not concerned about how much it is, and I’m not concerned about what I get. And that’s government"

Milton Friedman had it right about government spending. He also advocated cutting taxes whenever and wherever possible, for whatever reason, as he was (correctly in my view) of the opinion that a person knows how to spend their money far better than the government knows how to spend it.

Nick

You've certainly caught me off guard with this one.

Is there a chance that the british public will finally start getting the truth on Gordons 'international financial' reputation ?

I do hope so.


ps. - Any update on how the piece on Mandlesons dealings with oleg is coming along -- must be the size of war and peace by now...

Just why should "world leaders" buy into his (self-propagated) myth that Brown is uniquely capable of changing global financial conditions?

All they need to do is take a peek at the state of the UK economy and raise an eyebrow...

So, the guy who managed THIS mess is suddenly metamorphosed into a financial genius?

For goodness sake, the "rescue plan" was developed by commercial bankers. Not Brown.

No way to see whether it will work for several years to come. If it fails, it will definitely be re-written as the Darling Doctrine. That the way these folk work.

But, meantime, Brown is trying to achieve a shotgun marriage between a bank that seemed to be reasonably well run, and a badly mismanaged fruit case. Ripping up competition policy. (Looking after jobs in Scotland along the way... but that obviously never entered his head - because he's British.....)

At least in the fairy tale, the princess kissed the frog and it turned into a prince.

When Princess Tony kissed Gordon on his accession to the role of PM, the frog turned into a toad.

Nick

I couldn't give a fig what Professor Paul Krugman has to say in support of Gordon Brown. Krugman winning the Nobel Prize this year only goes to support the claim that the prize has been made political in recent years.

2007 Gore the Bore
2008 Krugman - anti Bush - tax and spend -
Keynesian.

Oh and he used to advise Enron.

We are in very deep trouble way worse than is being let on by our leaders.

We are heading for meltdown followed by the emergence of a new world order.

Lets take AIG. The losses there are going to be unimaginable and will make the $700bn bailout look like small change. You may or may not be aware that back in 1990 when Michael Milken (The Junk Bond King) was being thrown into prison for fraud and destroying Burnham Drexel Lambert one of his key associates Joseph Cassano slipped quietly from the wreckage to form AIG Financial Products, inside AIG. This creation is responsible for manuafacturing and sustaining the biggest financial bubble in history. AIG will soon completely explode and when it does it will shake the US to its core.

That you have managed to find someone in the US to comment on what is obvious to many and always was - you cannot live beyond your means forever just shows the utter level of insanity of our current age.

Why do you think China is holding back with its cash and good schools are already teaching Mandarin.

Perhaps our American friends are afraid Gordon Brown will try to get their new president to start the US on"the slippery slope towards socialism". I'm not likely to forget that congressman's comment before the presidential election, I could hardly believe my ears.
It just goes to prove there is still a vast difference between how the US is governed and the UK and not just the difference between a group of European islands and an American continent.
The Wall Street Journal comment illustrates this to perfection. Does the US care about Gordon Brown's aims or British politics in general? Apparently it disdains them utterly to the extent of being insulting.

43 manendo

I'm surprised they can even see the toenails.

Gordon appeals to the 'buy now, pay later' mentality which swept the country during the 'no return to boom and bust' years, which got us into this mess in the first place, but unfortunatly that ship has already sailed and won't be coming back anytime soon no matter how much debt Gordon gets us into.

What's going to become evident over the next few months is that there isn't going to be a return to the economic bubble based on debt that Brown encouraged and presided over and everything this man does while he's still in office is hollow promises that won't come to fruition in a vain attempt to stay in office.

Brown doesn't have a strategic plan, he's simply winging it and flying by the seat of his pants and hoping he gets away with pulverising the British economy into the dirt and it appears that not everyone is quite so easily fooled.

The WSJ got it spot on, this isn't about saving the world, this is about saving Gordons bacon, because once again the tide of approval is turning against him as the artificial 'bounce' disipates and gives way to reality that Labours only hope is to get a spring 2009 General Election underway and hope nobody realises why they're dumping all of their unpopular policies such as 42 days, post offices school testing and a whole host of other vote losing ideas.

Nick, you say not everyone here in America is "enamoured of Gordon Brown"

This may come a surprise, but not that many people are enamoured of him over here either!

#39 Charles_E_Hardwidge


"They're just attention seeking and trying to control the narrative that's circulating. Regular folks and thrill seekers get caught up in that, and lumping everyone in as a Tory just adds to their illusion of leadership and popularity. It's just a marketing scam to get you to talk about and/or buy their product, like all the cruddy shareware Windows optimisers and junk like that.

Anything positive about Labour is dissed into the ground, and anyone who says anything supported gets the same treatment. But, any excuse to talk up or high-five anything positive about their chosen product is seized on like an alchoholic returning to the whiskey. Show some doubt and they never attack you but smooch in the hope you'll join their team.

Attacking this grouping as "Tories" just annoys independent voters and drives them further into the warm and oh so friendly arms of the Bullingdon gang. This is a losing strategy which is why maturity, demonstrating solutions to people's problems, and just acknowledging regular folks in a friendly way is the best path Labour can follow: achievement, love, and reality are Labour's best tools."

Why don't you just dump all the party political stuff?

The majority of folk I've known are quite happy to vote for a political group of any persuasion, if they deliver what they promise.

Brown promised an end to house-price bubbles. What happened?

Promised borrowing only for investments. What happened?

Promised light-touch, but effective regulation. What happened?

I don't care if the guy is a born-again conservative or a Trotskyite. He has damaged the economy, when all the sensible - and easy - options suggested that the UK should have been making real progress.

I can't see how any politician can expect the electorate to forget everything before the day when he had this startling conversion on the way to Damascus.

(Forget the taxpaid funny jobs. Forget the 10p tax fiasco. Forget stealth taxes. Forget a lack of investment in energy. Forget the fact that we - as the sole owners - had no idea what to do with the private company called Royal Mail.
Just look at me now!
Global leader.
Surrounded by the folk who can shape the way you poor saps can view the world - with our permission...)

Man's so far past his intellectual sell-by date.

I even had a tiny, nasty feeling that he encouraged his mate Blank from Lloyds to take over HBoS, because he'd like a job with a banking group when he leaves office...

After all, Good Socialist Blair gets paid by a bank, so why not his co-architect of the great social project...

#26 goldtrebor

I broadly agree with what you say about GB but DC can hardly say "Problems that he himself has created through 11 years of irresponsible government" when DC would probably NOT have regulated the banks better.

In fairness I doubt that he would have allowed so much debt to build up but we would still have had pretty much the same exposure to bad loans and Credit Default Swaps.

Even Vince Cable only spoke of the debt and not more about regulation and risk analysis factors (so far as I know).

But perhaps this sleight of hand by Brown will backfire badly as if the public gets a better grip on what has gone down and confidence in GB disappears .....

#39

I know Charles. All these attention seeking grown ups. That's your job, isn't it?

Still, isn't it nice to get a non-partisan view from those lovely Americans, eh?

You mustn't throw a tantrum just because they don't agree with you, though.

What's all this about HBOS again? Clearly Alex Salmond as if that mattered is against the Lloyds takeover, and while the the fact that BoS belonged to the Halifax Building Society all along does not make it a serious cause celebre for the SNP (are there any?), the deal does seems to be gathering distractions like barnacles on an old boat. As an egregious commercial solution the TSB takeover has had remarkable support from public funds at a time when nationalisation has come to seem rational elsewhere. The absurdity of Mr Salmond's claims does not in itself excuse the embarrassing wait to get this wretched hulk into the water.

#39

As opposed to Brown, Milliband & Balls who are Labour's biggest tools?

Brown doesn't have a plan, he's just winging it and flying by the seat of his pants, hoping that the Joe Public don't realise that he's hiding behind a global downturn to disguise the absolute catastrophe he caused in this country through ecouraging an unsustainable debt based economy.

It seems the Americans are wising up to the man and treating him with the contempt he deserves, how long before the British media see through the nonsense and the artificial Brown bounce is consigned to the dustbin of failure where it belongs.

It's about time we accepted the inevitable, regardless of how much money Brown borrows and squanders to cover his misdoing, we're not going to be albe to get back to the artificial economy he so proudly presided over and everything he says now is just hollow and meaningless.

Call an election Gordon, you know you want to and don't have much choice, before the real weight of recession hits us, this is why the government are shedding unpopular policy like 42 days and school testing and undoing the post office fiasco like there's no tommorrow.

I really do despair that this Country is turning itself to the worst excesses of Mccarty-ism!

Anyone with a view that does NOT back and cow-tow totally to the line of the Daily Mail,IT,Evening Standard and the worst of the Murdoch press - including the NYT - is deemed to be some cold of sub-human alien life-form devoid of brain and intellect.

Firstly we were told that the whole of the bbc was corrupt and Bolshevik-simply returning to the worst days of Thatcher and Tebbit

Next we are told that Nick Robinson,a respected journalist is Alastair Campbell in disguise.

The witch-hunt has begun in aearnest,I even see ridiculous claims that Cameron,and I assume bt definition Clegg should get equal airtime,as should their parties to the Government of the day - what wonderful broadcasting that would lead to - here is the news 10 minutes of factual debate - followed by some homespun twaddle about Dave cleaning the dishes.

What makes things worse is that ITN in paticular continues to proport to be a "news" organisation whilst giving free rein to the two most biased incompetent so-called journalists I have ever seen - Tom" now lets get you walking to the camera Dave and ask you a nice question" Bradbury and Daisy"having destroyed Charles as my initiation I'll now adopt the doomsday mantle" Mc Andrew.

If anyone,and I mean anyone serious about politics wants to read and watch unbiased and sensible reporting of issues,objective and well reported the BBC and indeed BBC World Service remain the absolute bastions of honesty and decency trusted throughout the world - everywhere it seems apart from Eton and South Britain!

Lay off Nick Robinson,I dont always agree with him,but as a political commentator he is as good as their is...

I repeat what I asked yesterday....

Name one Government in British history whose policies over the past decade would have made any difference to the current worldwide economic downturn?

NAME AND EXPLIAN THE POLICIES OF ANY GOVERNMENT by whose policies we would NOT have been facing recession,a banking crisis and rising unemployment.?

Brown has made mistakes,he made some the Tories would have made,he made some he has made himself,overall I believe we are better placed than most,and unlike Cameron,who has no real economic policy,certainly NOT a global one,Gordon is in there fighting for Britain,fighting for the World and coming up with progressive and plausible options for the future...

....queue little enganders!

I can't say that I'm a fan of Brown, either. After all, it was his decision to replace RPI with CPI as the MPC's inflation target, removing house prices from the equation in 2003. Rates dropped, a bubble developed and debt soared.

Brown didn't trigger the economic crisis, but he is very much responsible for the excessive debt we face in the UK, and for making the situation much, much worse here than it should have been.

#58

Fact is, Cameron doesn't need to prove anything about what he might or might not have done, 'cos the only thing that matters is what Brown/Bliar did do, and that's why the labour supporters in the media hate the lack of policies. It doesn't give them any ammunition.

The fact that whatever the Tories come up with will be just as hopeless doesn't matter. You can't get hung for not having a policy half as easily as you can for having the wrong one.

It's called the price of responsibility, and like just about everything else, Brown is about to find out he can't afford that either.

As has been said many times before, oppositions don't win elections, governments lose them.

#29 balhamu

Good to see the newlabour hubris is still alive and kicking.

Your claim tha a business friendly newspaper sponsored by Rupert Murdoch is anti Gordon Brown had me laughing all the way to the polling booth.

You are making exactly the oppsite point to that which you intend; Rupert Murdoch is the man who told his readers to vote for Tony Blair and successfully called the result of three general elections.

Rupert Murdoch turning against the newlabour crash machine will have Alistair Campbell and Peter Mandelson reaching for the defibrilators. It's a disaster to lose the support of the most influential editor in the UK.

But then again the crass link to wikipeida says it all; newlabour apologists have the thinnest grasp of the level of conciousness and knowledge of the rest of the country.

We know Gordon Brown Is to blame for the credit boom and we know he;s to blame for the bust. We know it's the newlabour bust that is breaking sterling now down 43% against the Swiss Franc in a year.

It's sad that newlabour have taken the rest of the country for fools but now to take the third estate for a fool they are sealing their own death warrants.

Call an election.

They are absolutely right. We shouldn't spend our way out of this, we should cut interest rates only to stimulate the economy not to encourage borrowing and we should be cutting big ticket projects - such as ID and Trident for the next 3-4 years until the finances are better. We are all tightening our belts, why doesn't the government instead of borrowing?

Oh sorry I forgot, they are incompetents!

This 'Brown bounce' will be short lived.

Mandelson, Campbell and Robinson have been doing their best but you simply can't polish a turd.

Brown must live in a bizarre world, teetering on the edge between reality and fantasy. One minute world leader, the next Mr Bean. Carrying that sort of baggage around with you must be difficult and despite his entourage's best efforts Brown just couldn't help cocking things up. His Stalinist disdain for Cameron's questions on Wednesday were enough to end his mini Westminster revival.

He'll return from America thinking he's Keynes’ heir; the shining light to lead the world away from financial catastrophe. In reality that meeting is mickey mouse and everyone knows it bar Gordon. The man who couldn't balance the books of a whelk stall is fiddling while his country burns.

Will no-one explain to me how by lowering interest rates as THE method of stimulating the economy that this will not immediately turn into asset price inflation?

One of the major contributory factors to the housing boom on both sides of the Atlantic was the fact that interest rates were too low for the last decade or more. So now we hope by lowering them again WITHOUT any other controls on lending somehow we will get virtuous investment in commercial productive assets and not simply see the money vanish into overpriced houses purchased by people who cannot afford the loans.

I still view our central bankers on both sides of the Atlantic as at best unwise and at worst ...

Economic stimulation should be through labour intensive public works and cash directly to the people NOT through the Banks as they will simply line their own pockets.

#63 & 64

You guys make a great double act. Very funny. But tone it down a bit, if you don't let Charles have all the best lines he'll go in the huff.

The fact that the Wall Street Journal sees through Brown's posturing is a relief to those of who are dismayed at how many people have been taken in by his spin machine.

A decade in charge of the economy during benign global conditions and all he's done is run up huge debts. I wouldn't mind so much if public services had improved proportionally to the level of "investment" but we all know they haven't.

A child dies and all the person in charge does is hold up a graph to show the targets they've met. For me, that just about sums up the problem.

Americans in "not stupid" shock. Well I never. Do you mean, Nick, that others do not rate Brown as highly as us^h^, sorry, you.

Here's another Amurkan on Ther Great Helmsman. c 35 seconds in. He's nailed the guy straight off.

https://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=184086&title=sarah-palin-gender-card

Tory Central Office and the Daily Mail & Express must have an army of writers knocking out these posts everyday!!

Or they are middle-upper class Thatcherite Tories who dislike Brown as they fear a tax hike, and have recently seen their investments and pensions reduce in value, so come here and spit childish vitriol at Brown and Nick Robinson, pathetic.

Yes mistakes were made on the economy, and Brown is probably very aware of these, so he is trying to correct them.
But I've recently visited my brand new local hospital, which is a vast improvement to what it replaced. I was seen very quickly, and will have an Op in a couple of weeks, not like the last time I had to have an Op in 96, weeks wait to be seen, then months for the Op.
My sisters children attend the local secondary school, which has been rebuilt and seen a huge improvement in grades, not like the crumbling mess my brother attended when he was younger.

And this has been done by Labour, after years of Tory neglect and tax cuts that achieve nothing except line the pockets of the rich.

Try this one!

https://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml?videoId=209421&title=international-male

#63

Quite right. You stick up for the impartiality of the BBC. There's too many people out there having a go at them for no reason whatsoever....

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/7727929.stm

....er, or maybe not.

#69

LOL

You're being faintly disrepectful to the humble whelk stall.

The guy has become a complete and utter joke.

Nick, have you been promised a position in the NuLab spin machine when your BBC contract is up ?

Its a fair question as its the only honest and logical reason I can think of for your gradual lurch to the left over the past 6 months.

Unless of course its a ploy to take attention away from Robert Peston, who lets face it has hogged your limelight lately.

RE 58 thegangofone

I do agree that, in the end, it will be the publics confidence in Brown that will determine their voting direction.

The question is, how will this play out?

My view is that,
There is nothing GB can do to stop UK unemployment from rising and rising…
There is nothing GB can do to force the power companies to reduce their bills…
There is nothing GB can do to stem the fall in house prices or reduce the number of repossessions …
There is nothing GB can do to stop the banks from forcing small businesses to close as they have their facilities withdrawn…
There is nothing GB can do to change his personality…
There is nothing GB can do to stop his good pal Mandy from tripping up again…

In a way – DC does not have to do anything …
Apart from saying…

Gordon Brown inherited a GREAT BRITAIN…

He will leave us with a SKINT BRITAIN….

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Comment # 70 ends nicely; this is proven by the fact they're not forgoing their bonuses this year, despite the complete mess the financial system is in.

All Gordy B did was make sure there THEY have a nice warm and healthy christmas while their customers and tax-payers pay for it.

Nice.

gordon brown and this neu labour government are traitors and as such should not hold any post in uk government.

they have sold us up the river.

traitors should be publicly humiliated then executed.

gordon brown is so busy enjoying himself at our expence the problems here are increasing due mainly to an inept and greedy government lead by people best served behind bars at least.

they have no answers or and inclination to do anything about uk problems, except create more.

74.

most of these shiny new hospitals and schools have been built via PFI. If I went and bought a new house and left my kids to spend the next 30 years paying off the mortgage, well what wouldn't be so smart would it?

80

Priceless

But I've recently visited my brand new local hospital, which is a vast improvement to what it replaced. I was seen very quickly, and will have an Op in a couple of weeks, not like the last time I had to have an Op in 96, weeks wait to be seen, then months for the Op.
My sisters children attend the local secondary school, which has been rebuilt and seen a huge improvement in grades, not like the crumbling mess my brother attended when he was younger.

Yeah right. Well worth trashing the entire UK economy, throwing over a million on the dole and flushing sterling down the toilet for. A new building with machines that go 'ping' and a shiny school to hand out dumbed-down bits of bog-roll masquerading as qualifications.

Zip-de-do.

My cup runneth over. Not.

Meanwhile the entire population has run up debts of several hundred billion quid. Likewise the government has run up debts of several hundred billion quid and all for an improvement in 'investment in infrastructure' of 0.3% of GDP per year.

Still, best of luck with your operation. I hope it was worth beggering the entire country to get it done a few weeks early.

#74

Yeah, but you see, what you're not getting here is that the reason you've got a nice shiny new hospital and lots of well paid nurses (justified) and doctors (less so) is because Gordon's been writing dud cheques for the last ten years and they just started bouncing.

Some may argue it was worth the pain we are all about to endure. I'm afraid I'm not one of them.

Tell me something Nick...

If the UK is suffering because of problems in the US, and we are blessed with such a great leader that he's about to become king of the world due to his great fiscal and monetary insight...

'' just why has sterling lost 25% of its value against the dollar?

Note the words " spending spree . . . higher taxes . . . more borrowing . . won't stimulate " So what's new with GB?

Also note the preceding paragraph in the editorial namely:-
"British Prime Minister Gordon Brown has been especially voluble, yesterday suggesting that the world should pass a coordinated fiscal stimulus. "By acting now we can stimulate growth in all our economies," said the PM, without offering many details. "There is a need for urgency."

Nick why not refer to "especially voluble" and "without offering many details"?

Listing Professor Krugman is a fan of Gordon Browns. He was also a Board level advisor to Enron. Enron went bust and so will the UK if Mr Brown is left in charge much longer.

Way to go Nick. Way to go! You've eventually gone up in my estimation. I wasn't aware of the US reservations (aside from those in the West that have casinos on their land). Keep it up!

#80...

ROTFLMAO

what did post 80 say? some of us missed it...

Nick -- have always appreciated reading the Wall Street Journal. They give serious and balanced financial commentary -- something that the BBC [esepcially Robert and yourself] fail to do these days. Like many reading your comments -- your positioning does appear to be very pro Brown and Labour -- certainly not informative, analytical or balanced.

Feel it is high for you to re think your position or move on to a different role within the BBC.

#63 :

back to school my friend -- "as good as their is . . . "

Think the correct english is:

"as good as there is . . "

No ownership needed here !

Gordon is a politician. He continuously tries to define how he is perceived. He is not an intellectual heavyweight and has no more capability at understanding or responding to this situation than Joe Average. Just another unpleasant person in a position of authority which he feels is his natural due.

#95?

what a purile waste of energy.

Do you think for a second that you come over less ugly than th picture you portray?

You have a natural talent for self description it seams.

I don't see him wearing his pants over his trousers yet...

I find it increddible we are heading back down the route that lead to '79. Economy grows because the private sector is strong and grows. If Mr Brown goes ahead with this financial kamikaze policy we will feel the fain for many amny years to come. The best way to deal with this crisis is to encourage the private sector to grow not slash personal taxes. The Torries must put forward a strng arguement against this and show the public what will happen not tomorrow but in 18 months 3 years time. The pain will be long lasting unless Brown is stopped. His recent interventions have been necessary (cutting intrest, funding banks) but these huge tax cuts will cripple us for years to come and undo the work of Thatcherism tat lead to 16 years of ecenomic growth after the ecenomic pain of the 70's lets go forward not backwards.

I don't know why the media have let up on Brown, maybe it's because the Tories are useless, maybe they've just got bored of kicking him, because he certainly isn't the one fixing anything

But don't worry Gordon, you're still going...

Cling on to the bitter end and see what that does for your place in history

#31

The title "He's a fan..." is surely a play on the series of advertisements in the 'Economist' magazine for a famous hotel chain?