Taking the credit

There is a reason why the FSA had to invoke this now and not when some "magical calm" appears on the horizon.

A new character in the pantomime, Banking Bill. Plenty of stuff to write about, how about a franchise for a kids tv series then.

Brown caught lying again, colour me shocked.

For someone who keeps waffling on about trust and transparency, you'd think he'd try taking a dose of them himself.

Nick; please stop embedding movie files within your pages; it kills people's browsers and is unnecessary; use links instead.

If you're not careful people will start boycotting your blog because they're scared their laptop fan will explode just like it does on the sky site.

I recall David Cameron calling for increase to £50,000 after Northern Rock .. 1 year ago.. I also recall David Cameron asking for Parliament to be extended (summer break) to put this bill through..so if the FSA already had this power why wasn't this highlighted and executed immediately at that time?

Taking the credit - more like taking the p...

Why could Gordon Brown simply not followed the lead of the Irish? Instead he says 'up to 50000' - but nobody has lost any money yet. What does this mean?

Which part of the Treasury is so scared of an unlimited guarantee if it is implied by Gordon Brown in his supporting statements?

Gordon Brown took "credit" for getting the americans to pass the bill that he says he told them to enact (then it failed).

No surprises at all that Brown wants to take credit for something else that he didn't do or even know anything about.

It appears by your interview Brown is unaware that the FSA already has the power to increase deposit protection and does not need legislation, or am i just confused? please can you clear this confusion Nick?
very strange!

#1 JobyJak

I have no idea what point you are trying to make.

Unlike your normal posting on sports blogs, some resemblance to making a point helps.

Cameron could be forgiven for getting this wrong - he doesn't have the civil service at his disposal.

For Brown to get it wrong - after all isn't he noted for his massive attention to detail - is incompetent.

I was going to say 'shockingly' incompetent -but nothing about brown could shock me any more.

Don't make me laugh about Flash Gordon "doing whatever it takes to protect savings".

The truth is that Brown has deliberately penalized everybody who has savings in PRUDENTLY run traditional building societies, by making those societies pay for the idiocy of wannabe banks like Bradford and Bingley.

If those societies have to pay out compensation funds, that much mean lower rates for savers.

Another day, another stealth tax, another pack of Labour lies.

The mods appear to be blocking me by ip address again.

Sorry mods. I will try again.

You, Nick, are telling us that the Financial Services Authority has the power to up the bank deposit guarantee from 35.5 grand to 50 grand and has done so today. The Prime Minister says its in the Banking Bill and does require parliamentary approval.

Not so much a question of taking the credit as taking the p**s.

Does anybody remember the Mock Auctions when bargains were offered at ridiculous prices? Colleagues of the spiv acting as the auctioneer were scattered through the audience and got the bargains at rock bottom prices or for nothing at all. This would send the greedy public into a spending frenzy, and forgetting the old motto that if it's too good to be true, it isn't true, they bid high for poor quality rubbish. Gordon Brown is the auctioneer, although I must admit he doesn't look very trustworthy, whilst Darling, Jack Straw and a few other key players are in for the game. Will the greedy public fall for it yet again?

Nick
Could you please answer me a question. Personal savings are currently protected up to £35,000 but what happens to company bank accounts?

4 getridofgordonnow

It's a bug that's been planted to check up on us. Big Brother is coming!

Well im glad Gordon has been able to muster up another quick plan to give him more time in the spotlight, he seems to be making an announcement about one thing or another on a daily basis just to eat away at Conservative party conference air time, and hasn't it worked?
I think a change in public opinion could be just around the corner if he keeps this up, its looking like Gordon's the rock and Cameron's the little pebble being blown about (in a kind of U shape) by the turbulent economic winds!

So is it cock up or conspiracy?

With this government I think I can bet my Bradford and Bingly shares on the former.

#2 "A new character in the pantomime, Banking Bill. Plenty of stuff to write about, how about a franchise for a kids tv series then".

Nah - we've got enough muppets in charge already thanks

does anyone know how the £35,000 rule applies to joint accounts? ie does it become £70,000 guaranteed?

17. govandpol


Derek Draper Cyborg Infestation Detected

Well here we are again, another mess, im frightened to turn the TV on for it just seems to get worse, Governments should protect their people, but we stand to lose all our savings because a few greedy banks tried to make easy money, and this Government like its done for years now stood by and allowed it. I am retired and living off the savings i made during my working life and because of this rubbish Government i could loose everything, its a crime but they will wring their hands and still walk away the richer.

20 Wildkaypea

Cover is per person and is double on a joint account

I am fed up with Gordon and Alistair saying "what ever it takes" every day, for the newest doom and gloom event...

I think "whatever David Cameron suggests" would be more accurate.

I am going to vote for "whoever it takes" to get them out of government.

#22

At the risk of prying into your financial affairs, what are you scared of losing?

Your savings should be guaranteed if they are in a bank (if you have less than £35,000 - soon to be £50,000). The Government has also shown every sign that it will not let a single retail (high street) bank go bust, and will make sure the taxpayer protects your savings.

I thought pensions funds generally went into safer assets such as bonds or an annuity when you retired (maybe I'm wrong), so you should be ok there (unless you invested some savings in Northern Rock or something).

The equity you have tied up in your home will decrease, but unless you were a first-time buyer in the previous 10 years that was only a paper fortune anyway.

Another reason why this man needs to go................he is just not on top of his job....................and never has been!

Watch this space guys.............Crash Gordon's is going to load the taxpayer with a massive debt to try to get re-elected.

Prediction 1. Complete rewrite of the fiscal rules enabling mega borrowing...all to the spent before the next election.

Prediction 2. Bank of Englands remit to be rewritten to include growth targets as in the US......hence massive interest rate cuts.

Who ever wins the next election will have 5 years to get the economy back on track and deal with the effects............mega debt and mega inflation.

If he says a categoric "yes" to the increased cover to £50,000 it could be disastrous if they DO have to pay out left right and centre if several banks go down.

He is being cautious, a little bit here, a little bit there, let's test the water but of course if a single bank goes then those depositors will be safe. Just doesn't want to make sweeping decisions in case it's not necessary and it all blows over.

Wish I'd spread my money though like I was advised. Never thought it would come to this.

What about the British arms of European banks such as Ing Direct? I know they are covered to the same degree here by FSA but also by the Dutch regs. However, in the event of them going down would our Government prevaricate and try and shove it all onto the Dutch Ing?


FS and I are about the safest at the moment methinks.

Chuckle. Its an achievement when you can put a pound in the bank and go back and get it. Thats progress for you. We don't have a problem and the age of irresponsibility has passed. Whatever it takes. Think I'll watch an old movie and pretend its not 2008, get rid of that queasiness and stop feeling browned off.

#21 CarrotsneedaQUANGO2

Great method - those pesky little critters seem to keep on coming, though.

Gordon Brown should read Robert Peston's blogs. A guarantee of £50,000 on deposits is peanuts to fund managers who move millions between banks. Perhaps Brown will get the message when all the big funds start flowing out of the UK into the 100% security of the Irish banks, and our banks start going belly up. Duh!

Nick Robinson pressing the right buttons and watching his blog comment rating shoot up again. Isn't he popular! Neither Cameron or brown can take credit as both parties have allowed this to happen. Thatcherite Deregulation Dogma infects this country and is seeping puss all over this once great nation.

There that proves I am not a Derek Draper clone stop this 'hilarious' joke before I split my sides. Perhaps if you find the name for the Lib dem PR bloke on the Internet you can call me a clone of him. Its not like the Conservatives are innocent on the Internet PR front.

We seem to have an irresponsible government lead by a novice. It must be frustrating being a Civil Servant in Whitehall.

You can tell Gordon Brown, but not a lot.

Transfer funds to Ireland! Good idea - but suffer the penalties of early withdrawal from Fixed Term savings.



Meant to say above NS and I not FS and I = silly me!


I think Nick tackled Crash Gordon earlier than the latter wanted - ie Crash wanted to make it a plus point at a later date. Vote puller.

#31 ohsilly-me

True, but he'd have done better still to have supported joining the Euro from day one to limit the risk.

A scheme on the Irish lines with strict nationalistion without compensation for any bank that fails to meet FSA standards may have to happen before too long.

#25 balhamu wrote:

At the risk of prying into your financial affairs, what are you scared of losing?

This seems to imply you can't imagine anybody with enough savings to worry...!

Your savings should be guaranteed if they are in a bank (if you have less than ?35,000 - soon to be ?50,000). The Government has also shown every sign that it will not let a single retail (high street) bank go bust, and will make sure the taxpayer protects your savings.

Hmm. Everybody thought the US govt would step in every time, and then came Lehman Brothers... With Governments as with investments, past performance is not necessarily a good indication of the future.

I thought pensions funds generally went into safer assets such as bonds or an annuity when you retired (maybe I'm wrong), so you should be ok there (unless you invested some savings in Northern Rock or something).

Oh dear. Our survey said... uh-oh. The "safer assets" were the norm until Gordon Brown noticed that pension funds were an area he hadn't taxed yet. So he slapped a tax on their profits. This - and the effect of compounding the now-reduced funds - more-or-less forced pension funds to chase higher-yielding - but riskier - investments. However they couldn't be seen to buy low-grade investments, and so the insurance-backed CDO/S was born - all the yield of the riskier stuff, without, err, the risk.

Gordon Brown is the prime architect of this crisis (with that pension fund smash-and-grab raid, as well as the bubble-prolonging shared ownership schemes, and so on and so forth) in so many ways.

Never mind an election - we need a coup, now.

The equity you have tied up in your home will decrease, but unless you were a first-time buyer in the previous 10 years that was only a paper fortune anyway.

I'm not even going to bother to comment on this statement - it is so far from the truth for most people as to be laughable. Where do you think all of the "miracle" consumer spending came from? What about the increased cost of upgrading house due to wider spreads? You may be unaffected by this crisis, but most are not.

At the height of the Northern Rock debacle last year, did that clown Darling not undertake to increase the limit from £35,000 to £100,000?

Day by day GB is digging an ever deeper hole for himself. His lack of confidence and lack of resolve to take effective action when the answer is staring him in the face is mind blowing.
In all of his budgets his policy has been to effect at once any measure which would disadvantage the electorate whilst delaying any advantageous measures for at least 12 to 18 months.
In a critical situation as we have now you would expect that even he would have the wit to realise that this is a time for immediate action and not prevarication.
God help us.

It realy gets to me that the banks were overcharging and about to be brought to account when the meltdown hit.
The bankers were fleecing people and they were having a high old time with plenty of golden handshakes.
Now we have to bail them out and they watch as the country goes broke, people with nothing but an average weeks wages who couldn't afford to save are left without employment.
The sheer greed and lack of any morals is disgusting.

"the government had intervened where necessary and no depositors had yet lost money" gordon brown, alistair darling, other labour ministers (the latest soundbite?)
- british taxpayer's are "depositors" they deposit cash into the government's pockets, whats happening to this?

how much is involved?
which institutions are being given taxpayers money?
is this taxpayer's money already in the coffers or are they planning to borrow more to pay for it?
its all too vague!

which leads to the next point/question:
we keep being told that brown and darling will do "whatever it takes to protect people"
- they never actually tell us how they are "protecting" people?

are they borrowing money?
are they cutting funding across government departments?
is it a combination of both?
what are the timescales for paying money back?
what are the guarantees the taxpayer will get it back?
we dont want soundbites we demand answers.
- a statement to the house of commons should be made on what "protection" has involved.
darling and brown should be there to answer questions from all sides.

"Northern Rock guaranteed the deposits of those people who were saving with Northern Rock," - we saw then exactly how much it cost taxpayers!
"Bradford and Bingley safeguarded the deposits by moving them to Abbey National," - this wasnt brown or darling,it was a cheap buy out of more than £20 BILLION pounds of savings accounts, sold for less than £1 BILLION!
"Halifax Bank of Scotland we moved them to Lloyds TSB." - again brown and darling didnt do this at all... and if this a successful rescue measure by brown,then why did he block his good friend (chairman of lloyds) from buying out northern rock?
once again, brown simply allowed the competition commission to ignore the sale of the bank for a knockdown price.

The final point goes to the FSA, "the deposit guarantee limit we have announced will increase to £50,000 - we have announced it now as the markets are calm!"

absolute classic this one.... biggest falls and increases, in history, 4 times over the last two weeks and the FSA think the markets are "calm"
even brown jumped on the bandwagon saying that "we have raised the threshold to £50,000!"

i dont trust brown one inch with the economy - hes hiding a nasty sting for the taxpayers of the UK further down the line,otherwise hed tell us exactly what hes actually done to sort the mess he and the FSA sat back and allowed to happen.

BROWN’S SPIN ON HIS BUZZ WORD: STABILITY

BROWN WHEN CHANCELLOR, IN EFFECT, HANDED HIS CONTROL AUTHORITY AND THE STABILITY OF OUR ECONOMY TO UNSCRUPULOUS GREEDY BANKERS IN THE USA A FOREIGN COUNTRY. BY CHANGING THE SYSTEM IN 1997 HE ALLOWED COLLATERAL, BACKED WITH MORTGAGES TO BE TAKEN OUT OF THE PROTECTION AND CONTROL OF BRITISH REGULATION AND JURISDICTION.

Re 36

Yup.

If Greenspan reckon that the US domestic housing market stablisation is key to recovery and the UK economy is at least in part similar it is very worrying.

Property prices ended up topping out at x6.5 earnings, with x4.5 having been the historical level (over extended period) before the Bubble bath got going.

Prices are dropping but still have some way to go it would seem. There is a lot of exposure due to come. It is not clear where the bottom is, x4.5 or an overshoot lower(x4). Perhaps the bottom is not as low as 4.5 due to the inbuilt property shortage that is already here. I don't think anybody knows.

However wherever it ends up it is going to freeze many in their current house even if they can afford to maintain it which has all sort of implications, labour mobility, disposable income. You can't sell to break out.

The banks must have the some figures and so must the government but who wants to break bad news. The banks only regard people with a 25% deposit as safe. Thats quite a safety margin. That FSA guy looked twitchy, Paulson looks twitchy.

Every time Greenspan speaks the bottom out moves further forward, it fairly rapidly has moved from 2009 to 2010 as a probable pick up point.

The figures tell there has been a great deal of UK remortgaging as a form of asset stripping by housholders, its not just a question of people who entered the market in the last couple of years.

It usually takes about 5 years for a housing market recovery to really get going following a major hit but this level of debt is new ground. Unemployment usually lags a downturn by 3 years and job creation 3 years from an upturn.

Nobody in there right mind would first time buy until the bottom was hit for sure so that is not going to help new blood. The market has frozen over before but there hasnt been this sort of price drop concurrent with it.

If you take the bubble and invert it and say thats whats going to be the environment it is going to be difficult.

I groaned when DC said he had a plan. Much prefered Paul Newmans motto, If we've got a plan we're screwed. How can you have a plan when you don't know what the problem is because you don't know where the bottom is.

Unless we are very lucky - Private sector shrinkage coming followed by public sector cuts. It is not actually going to make much difference who is in charge, even if NuLab come to their senses, the debt still has to be cleared.

If anybody thinks it is only people who entered the housing market recently who are going to have a problem, who knows.

Re 32

Take it easy, nobody wants you to fall on your dkwilkinson sword

Someone please sort the software out on this website!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gordon and David may TRY to take the credit but it will surely backfire as the public catch up with what their favourite (?) politicians HAVEN'T been doing to protect the economy.

Gordon will get a lot of the flak but I don't see the Tories getting an easy ride as they were in power before and it will make tricky economic policy in the future even trickier now.

If there be wolves beneath the Tory sheeps clothing methinks they will show through soon.

Stop Press - Gurkhas WON at the High Court.

If left to its own devices the FSA would do everything "eventually"

They will show their teeth when absolutely needed, but other than that they tend to feel that what they do and how they regulate is not the business of politicians or the public and we should leave them alone.

By wording his answer as he did, brown has pushed them onto the back foot - which is exactly the place they should be!

Mr Robinson, sometimes I think you are so keen to look for something to have an opinion about that you miss the screamingly obvious.

Could it be that Nick is also trying to hang on to his job ?
Even Polly has given up on Gordon but Nick still gets his perks by traveling with Dave (interview on the train with breakfast)
Face it Nick - your gravy train is going to hit the buffers and you won't be top of the rescue list.

nick well spotted - you have been closely observing G. Brown and I sense that his incompetence is surprising and scaring you. the 'clunking great fist' is revealing itself as being a blunt and blind instrument who is not in control.

Nick

With brown waffleing on about stability and the such, maybe you could ask him about the major international companies who are moving their HQ's from the UK (many to Ireland).

It make the news on radio 4 this morning, but doesn't seem to have made it onto the website...

The chief exec explained that it was due to concern over labours tax plans.

And not what is in place, but what they THINK will be happening in the near future.

So Brown/Darling have introduced such doubt and instability that these companies are moving offshore because they don't know what the government are up to, but beleive it will be bad.

If that isn't instability, I don't know what is.

On the PM's interview.

Cameron has nailed him on this one - while Brown spins that it is all OK and there is nothing to worry about - "Trusssttt in meeeee, trusssttttt in meee" he hisses as he squeezes the life out of the country.

Cameron is showing his maturity and telling it as it is -- it is VERY bad, and sorting it out will be VERY UNCOMFORTABLE.

Like Thatcher - there will be *genuinely* difficult decisions to be made to put the country back in order again - the public aren't stupid children (however the socialists treat them) and will put up with pain if it is genuinely required.

And all this melt down is just little preview of what we have to come when the pension crisis really hits -- europe cannot afford the pensions they have promised, and this is a taster of the real meltdown to come.

#42 Glanafon

You have hit the target.
I am beginning to wonder if it would be better to leave Brown to sort out his own mess. The idea of our "brilliant, most successful Chancellor of the last century" and Prime Minister having to go cap in hand to the IMF would clear up any doubt.
This fiasco will go down in history on par with the South Sea Bubble.

My view of this story is that it casts light on the characters of politicians, authorities, and the media but I don't think it's especially helpful and a lot of folks have missed the important bits.

The Prime Minister seems more focused on the big picture, and it's not unusual for a fumble of detail like that to be made. I have a similar character type and have a nasty habit of making typos. Cameron's character is much more populist and suffers from intellectual spin. He changes his opinion more than he changes his socks. The regulator isn't terribly exciting but seems to be acting responsibly. Nick is getting some "facts" but suffering from the law of unintended consequences. As with the Northern Rock issue, the media is just barging in and creating more problems.

So, there's lots of ego in here. I'm not too familiar with finance law or regulation but, I think, there's a case that things could be polished and folks could spend less time on tinkering and more on how they execute things. Law and scrutiny can help but also get in the way. The more personal and, arguably, more important issues tend to get lost in the squabble.

Locking people in an empty room until they calm down is probably more useful. Shut up. Do nothing. Be happy. You know the drill.

The Real Truth - very interesting. I didn't know that about major companies moving lock stock to Ireland. I don't blame them nor am I surprised.

Hasn't anyone noticed that ordinary people, families are moving out too? Thousands are moving abroad and others moving well away from "multi culturalism" in London to Devon, Cornwall etc. Mind you it won't be long before the ghettos set up down there also.

Brown just cannot see the picture - being borne out now with his dithering and lack of stamina and forthrightness in the financial crisis. The only way is up surely? Don't bet on it.....

#32 dhwilkinson

I agree 100% with your first para in that blame is shared, although with NuLab in power for 11+ years it can hardly be a 50/50 sharing of blame now.

Nobody ever thought you are a Derek Draper clone. The fact that you argue your position rather than simpy rubbish your opposition is testimony to that.

Good for you if you're joining the LibDems. Us Liberals sometimes fear centralising tendencies from their SDP, but at least the LibDems remain consistently in favour of the constitutional and electoral reform which may one day bring democracy to the UK.

#44 jonathan_cook

If you're talking about the slooooooooow loading of all these flash videos, amen.

If you're having trouble getting special characters to display, don't hold your breath. I reported the problem months ago and got a response confirming it had been passed on to the techies but I'm not holding my breath.

To be fair, that problem, like the ASCII character set itself, is that the software was designed in the USA, where diacritics and funny symbols are virtually unknown. It could be very slow to sort out.

If you're talking about other software problems, can you be more specific?

32. dhwilkinson:

Thatcherite Deregulation Dogma infects this country and is seeping puss all over this once great nation.



Thatll be the great nation presided over by Harold Wilson and Jim Callahan then will it.




Ahhh the good old days..... sighhhhh

#47 Gurubear

I'd certainly agree that the FSA should have got involved earlier, but wasn't it "Duff" Gordon & Co. who set it up in the first place?

If so, then it was surely NuLab's responsibility to make sure they were adequately pro-active, and if it doesn't need primary legislation to change the limit, why have the government made such a big deal of it?

54. flamepatricia




The rot sets in



Martin Sorrell's WPP Group is to leave the UK and shift its British headquarters to Ireland because of changes to the tax regime, which could cost the marketing group tens of millions of pounds.

Just a few more:




https://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/aug/28/ireland.banking

https://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/economics/article4633674.ece

Hasn't anyone noticed that ordinary people, families are moving out too? Thousands are moving abroad and others moving well away from "multi culturalism" in London to Devon, Cornwall etc. Mind you it won't be long before the ghettos set up down there also.

#49 eveadam

Hello, newbie. You're obviously not a Draper clone, but how about giving some input on what you want rather than what you don't?

"Gordon Brown should read Robert Peston's blogs."

We all should, and his analysis of this point was yesterday.

The HBOS_Lloyds deal was predictably dodgy and now turns out to be definitely dodgy, Cameron jumped into the gap left by Brown's continued hesitancy over deposit guarantees and has scored heavily with it at conference, nationalisation I would hazard the guess looms for HBOS and what looked like salvation for Gordon is looking like anything but. Just when you think he's losing it he gets another grip, but for how long?

Brown needs to Go. He will lumber and blunder from bad to worse. His rhetoric is repeatative and embarrassing with every opportunity taken to suggest that he is initiating action and leading the U.S and the world on policy and decion making. His personality is flawed and you can see he is self obsessed and depressed. His idea of a light touch would still mean suffocation. this is too high a price to pay for any previously perceived "flashes of genius". A new govt as soon as possible will improve market confidence and stability in this situation, will draw a line under this period of disaster after disaster, and is desperately needed. it will facilitate a mood of pulling together in the country. Gordon is not the solution, he is the problem.

So its no time for a novice eh? Could I ask we just have someone who knows what is possible rather than someone who seems to lack the basic knowledge for the job ?
And maybe its just me but didn't Cameron at least sound like someone who recognises the seriousness of the situation and is prepared to work with the government who created the regulatory mess to try and fix it ?

I've seen a few Tories in here hijack stuff now Cameron's lifting my material. I've been talking about stuff like that for as long as I've been posting here and Cameron gets a clue in the last week? His duty is to hold himself to account. That's the bit he doesn't get.

Cameron used emotional bullying to elbow his way to the front of the queue, started assuming an innocent look, and is now projecting an authoritative facade. This is the same dumb and impatient bully he was when he started. I see no change.

The Anglo-Saxon approach beats people down and takes sides. The only way this is going to change is if management respect people and their Tory pals share the wealth. Only another Labour government can deliver that.

I can only think that putting a limit on the amount of cash the Government is prepared to guarantee in savings and deposits is the possiblilty that those with hundreds of thousands in one financial institution might contemplate taking it out in cash and stuffing it in the mattress! Thus creating a greater squeeze on lending capacity.
The other advantage of putting a limit on the amount the Government is prepared to guarantee is that it may help to spread the resources of all savings, investments and deposits and thereby help to provide more mortgage lending capacity in a greater variety of banks and buildings societies.
Another point to be considered is that those lucky enough to have more than £50,000 in savings, could consider spending it on home improvements and property, portable or otherwise and this would help to boost employment and cash flow in the UK.

57 carrots..

Yes it was that bunch of loony lefties that allowed the Conservative party to stay in power for 18 years and start the country along its current path.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

#53

Spot on CEH - this interview certainly casts light on one particular character - Gordon Brown.

How many times did the man say "let's be honest" ????

First lesson of interaction one learns as an adolescent; if someone says 'honestly', 'let's be honest' or prefixes conversation with any such arning - the implication is he was being dishonest hitherto.

The man doesn't even understand the subject he's talking about; claims these lending practices started inthe states - okay go and get ius the numbers and prove they started in the states; they were going on here concurrently.

He talks about global flows of capital as if this is some new phenomenon - this is a two hundred year old phenomenon and he's supposed to be an ecenomic historian.

He seems to have erased his memory about what happened while he was chancellor of the exchequer.

Listening to this interview closely one can only come to one conclusion; the man is very close to breaking point.

Call an election.

And the next scoop story to put another nail in the coffin of this government:

"cabinet minister transfers six figure sum to Irish bank account"

The question is...which one(s)?

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Chuck_E_Hogwash @65 wrote:

"I've seen a few Tories in here hijack stuff now Cameron's lifting my material."

Crikey! You are so very modest.

I'm sure that Einstein would have found the unified field theory if only he'd looked at your notes.

Shakespeare would have written some better plays if he'd paid attention to your well-crafted sentences and illuminating perspectives on the human condition.

And if only he'd had a word with you first, God could have created the world in only five days and then we would have longer weekends.....

glanafon @ 42

I wouldn't worry too much about what the Poodle of Wall Street is saying. He is more responsible than any other single individual for this banking crisis. After the damage he has wreaked, he should be rocking quietly on his porch, rather than "contributing" further.

#67.

Wasn't it New Labour who demolished the previous regulatory regime, based on sector specialists, and set up the super-regulator, the FSA in 2001?

Wasn't it New Labour who took away banking supervision from the Bank of England and gave it to the FSA?

Isn't the FSA responsbile for financial markets regulation?

Didn't the FSA pick and choose from each of the previous regulatory bodies the rules it wanted to adopt, thereby creating confusion for months on end?

Hasn't Gordon been in charge all this time?

If you are going to cast a net for blame, can you try and be a little bit more accurate please? I don't think that's too much to ask.

Wake up nick!!!!!! IN LESS THAN 3 YEARS TIME YOU, YES YOU, WILL BE TELLING THE PUBLIC ABOUT THE FORTHCOMING AMERICAN UNION.....CANADA..USA..AND MEXICO WILL BE THE FIRST TO JOIN TOGETHER WITH A NEW CURRENCY CALLED , MAYBE, THE AMERO.......THIS WAS SIGNED IN 2005......FOLLOWED BY OTHER COUNTRIES OF THE AMERICAS....THE AGENDA IS SOOOO BORING...WE LIVE IN A REAL LIFE MATRIX......

People are overstating the extent of this UK property so called bubble. For many years, the value of property in the UK was depressed by high interest rates and undue restriction of credit. To get a mortgage in the old days, you used to have to go see your bank manager and virtually plead for the loan. Then, if he felt you were the right type, he might just give you one. In recent years, we have gone too far the other way (in particular with self cert and multiple BTL) but no way do we want to return to how it was.

Common mistake is to see average earnings as how best to value property. Not the case. To value a property, you take the rental income generated (or saved by buying instead of renting) and then you discount that expected future cash flow (in perpetuity) at an appropriate discount rate. The best discount rate to use is the rate at which mortgage finance is generally available.

Aside from the excesses of self cert and multiple BTL, the rise in the UK property market over the last few years has been a perfectly rational bidding up of prices in response to lower interest rates and the democratisation of credit. The problem is that those interest rates have been too low for too long ... courtesy of absurdly lax monetary policy from what is effectively the World's Central Bank, the Fed.

As soon as mortgage finance, at reasonable rates, becomes readily available again (but without the self cert and multiple BTL nonsense), property values will recover and stabilise at about 2006 prices. They will then start climbing again as fundamentals like increasing demand and limited supply kick in. In due course, we will look back on this period as delivering a modest and healthy downward correction. It's really nothing much to worry about in the context of the much larger upward correction in the years previous.

Please let's not get swept along with a misconception, just because everyone is now chuntering the same thing ... as regards the UK housing market, we've had a boom but not a bubble ... and this is not a bust.

#65

Nurse another sedative for Charlie Please!

What are you rambling on about?

You are right in the past we have seen attempts at sincerity from leader before that do rankle who could forget Blairs
"I...We...the Government drivel."

or Browns hankering as having a Puritan and holier than thou past.

Both have claimed to be "pretty honest/straight guys". Both have been proven liars.

Cameron does not have to anything more than provide an opposition to government until 2010.

Anything he says or does is rhetroic as he has no ability to action them to date. The government however DOES! This is where they are found wanting, and this is what they don't get.

We have had emotional bullying too from labour.

in the past. Everything from the ridiculous hand wringing and pleading from Blair with a teary eye stanging the absoulte need to send young men and women to thier deaths (not to mention the thousands of innocent civillians) in Iraq.

This in addition to Browns incomprehensible need to lock people up with no charge for 42 days. As we now live under a terrorist threat (what has changed since 1968, or are Islamic Terrorist slightly worse than Irish ones? racsist if you like on the governments part) This counrty has always been under terrorist threat, check out the gun powder plot!

So spare up the hard done by socialist line!

Last one, it is with pride that I look at this country as an Anglo-Saxon one. It is true we have lost our way by way of hankering to an ungrateful and selfish, self made underclass. Which includes the must have it now generation. They have largely caused the downturn in society with the notion that it is always someone elses fault, and not being accountable for thier actions.

Life is tough, and there are those who must be cared for, the infirm, young, elderly, and those who absoultely cannot support themselves, whether, a single parent or family carer. These people of course must be supported properly (which I personnally am not convinced is the present case anyway).

However the rest must bite the bullet, and hey! do without SKY and a PS3, or save up for one! rather than being given one as an incentive to be a good citizen. This is not poverty! Wake up and do something yourself. It is possible.

It is sad that as a last refuge from a disgruntled Labourite it to state the case of Tory Toff and thier rich pals.

Blair, Harmon and a large majority of the goverment with the notable exception of Alan Johnson, have been born with silver spoons in thier supercillious gobs.

More ironically is the fact that this goverment has sent us into more campaigns (legal or otherwise) than any other government since World War 2 (more cost and bad reputation world wide).

If it was a matter for Labour and Conservative to stack up morally where would labour stand. I know of no Labour MP who have served in the forces. (They don't even show up when our dead arrive from the middle east). I can think of at least 4 High Profile Tories who have.

Time for a change and put some moral fibre into the country!

Goodbye Labour!

67. dhwilkinson

Precisely. you hit the nail right on the head.

One extreme from of politics leads to another, in fact it becomes a requirement in order to correct matters.


That is exactly why we dont need another 5 years of Browns socialism.

Put him in power for another term and the counrty will be praying for Thatcher to return.

65. Charles_E_Hardwidge


You dont half write some dross.


You accuse Cameron of being a bully but support Brown.

Now thats a classic.

65.Charles_E_Hardwidge wrote:

I've seen a few Tories in here hijack stuff now Cameron's lifting my material








Just thought it was worth repeating.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Listening to this interview closely one can only come to one conclusion; the man is very close to breaking point.

Nick,

1. This was Conservative policy and has been on their web site for ages

2. The Conservatives have been offering to implement this with Brown for a long while and until now have had no response from the government.

3. Brown has been dithering, he could have had first mover advantage. Instead he will now come under pressure to match the Irish 100% savings guarantee. If he had moved far earlier he could have rejected calls to match the Irish - since he could have claimed to have taken early and decisive action which was sufficient.

4. It was an obvious step to have taken months ago. If people do not feel secure with their savings they will remove it from the bank - and that causes poor liquidity and a run on a bank


It is time for 'Notta-Novice Brown' to hand over to the newcomers - who clearly have a better idea of what to do than Gordon.

Nurse another sedative for Charlie Please!

What are you rambling on about?

To MaxSceptic..your post @ 77 is pure brilliance..On a gloomy day i am still laughing

To MaxSceptic.. your post @ 72 is pure brilliance..On a gloomy day i am still laughing

Sounds to me that good old Gordon is doing what he always does: making it up as he goes along. I mean, just look at him, this 'great' leader with all this economic competence. What a joke. I think they call it 'firefighting' in some circles, doing the best you can in dire circumstances. Pretty tragic really watching him parade around the global stage peddling his 'economic credentials' after effectively turning UKplc into a basketcase. What a mess. The things some politicians do to look statesmanlike. Read the other day he gave his suit to some charity thing to be auctioned off, how come: the emperor has no clothes.

Nick, please, remove that "Click to Play" box. Yesterday in jest I wrote it was to bug us all, shades of Big Brother, but it really is a pain. It slows down the computer and blocks script. Does anybody else find problems?

80. At 10:42am on 01 Oct 2008, CarrotsneedaQUANGO2 wrote:
65.Charles_E_Hardwidge wrote:

I've seen a few Tories in here hijack stuff now Cameron's lifting my material

Just thought it was worth repeating.

Thanks Carrot for warning us all. I usually suffer from repeating when I've eaten unpalatable food. The next stage is actually vomiting, so it seems Brown has been pinching Charlie's ideas too!

Hi Nick,

Could you raise another aspect of the deposit guarantee issue please?

I am a director in a SME business, and a prudent one, ie. I manage the cash well, work hard and don't spend unnecessarily (boring some may say!) and certainly don't speculate with or throw other people's money away. So the company pension scheme has cash (wise, wasn't it, rather than do what advisors told to buy property or shares?), and so does the company. Great, you might say, but as I have been finding out, there is NO protection to savings on a company or pension fund account. True? Does the Irish deal cover all savings regardless of entity?

1) The issue I want you to raise is pension fund savings and deposit - they should be protected.

2) Business savings accounts should be protected too. It is quite an awful scenario to think you are in a great position for a donwturn, just having all company cash reserves being lost due to banks.

What do you think?

Charles


I am assuming you are using some kind of

ZEN!

random word generator, as you make no sense at all.

As the comdian Frankie Boyle stated

Sarah Browns diary must read.

Tuesday.....stayed in.....Gordon cried.

Pa ha ha

#72 MaxSceptic

ROFL

#82

I know my own antennae thanks, Chuck and I am putting money on him being gone by Christmas. He's toast. It's in every answer to every question; evasion and blaming and dithering and defeat.

Good news is Nick didn't let him off the hook about not answering questions properly.

Well played.

Thanks for your comments CEH but I seem to remember you being similarly bullish about Peter Hain's prospects shortly before he was driven away in a little white van.

Perhaps you'd like to offer me odds on him still being in office by Christmas if you are so sure.

Clall an election.

Re Cameron is lifting my ideas at 65. Does the 'E' stand for 'Ealing', as in one stop short of 'Barking' on the tube .

82: Zenmaster

Put one in on your next post Charles: we just love the Zen stuff.

#74 TerryNo2

What you say is largely true but be fair - in #67 dhwilkinson was actually being critical of old Labour's Wilson / Callaghan government for letting Thatcher in.

Had Callaghan listened to the group that left Labour to form the SDP or kept the Liberals onside with electoral reform, the past couple of decades would have been very different.

Eve @ 63

I kind of agree.

The policies are nothing terrible but it's the man, isn't it? ... rather sets one's teeth on edge, doesn't he?

54. At 08:26am on 01 Oct 2008, flamepatricia wrote:


Hasn't anyone noticed that ordinary people, families are moving out too? Thousands are moving abroad and others moving well away from "multi culturalism" in London to Devon, Cornwall etc. Mind you it won't be long before the ghettos set up down there also.


I agree with you, but you are lucky the moderators let this pass. Ever heard of bussing?

Sounds to me that good old Gordon is doing what he always does: making it up as he goes along.