Korean artillery clashes: Your reaction

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

Looks as though Kim Jong-Il has a son whose balls have finally dropped. Pity the boy has no brain to balance this advance into a thwarted adolescence.

It's time the world hit back at these outrages.

IF China has any sway over this criminal regime, it is time for it to make a positive move before the rest of the world is provoked into taking action - a course the criminals in North Korea seem hellbent on provoking.

"An eye for an eye. A tooth for a tooth."

"1 . At 11:23am on 23 Nov 2010, Kuradi Vitukari wrote:

Nuke 'em!"

I'm sure you're not being serious, but just in case other people follow your line of thinking - what about the poor subdued normal North Korean citizens who had no part in this nor likely agree with it?

Should other countries have nuked London for the decisions Labour made?!

For all the nutters wanting every country to have nukes, this is why responsible people say no.

There are only 2 reasons I believe we have not "liberated" North Korea.

1. They have no oil
2. They share a border with China so we do not want to risk upsetting them.

It's about time someone did something about this country. We went into Iraq because of WMDs and to topple Saddam. Well from what we have seen recently North Korea have a higher chance of getting WMDs than Iraq and Kim Jong Il is far more dangerous to us than Saddam ever was.

We need to get an agreement with China that involves us taking that country from 2 flanks at once.

The more we see, the more Bush was right about the axis of evil.

Under Bush, there was real progress with N. Korea. Under Obama, N. Korea, Syria and Iran do whatever they want and bomb whoever they want.

The one thing I can say for N. Korea is that unlike its Iranian and Syrian allies, it uses its own state and soldiers to attack the south. Whereas Iran and Syria use proxy armies and then feign innocence - which the left wing in Europe swallow each and every time.

1. At 11:23am on 23 Nov 2010, Kuradi Vitukari wrote:
Nuke 'em!

Hear hear, if it was only as easy as that. LOL

In all seriousness now though, what will happen if this does escalate? What will happen if the North does use nuclear weapons? I really don't want to be in the middle of World War 3 just because of the Koreas.

If the North uses nukes, then the US will use nukes, which the Chinese won't like, and most likely nor the Russians. I see escalation on a massive scale... :(

I suggest that we leave it to China, Russia, Japan and the USA to sort out.

The World picture - Analyzing individual cases masks the global picture and is misleading.

*N Korea aggressions and is increasing NUC capability are done openly as never before.
*The Islamists are on offensive in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, and Somalia as never before.
*Chaves is trying to create a NATO type organization of dictators and Theocratic.
*Iran is increasing the NUC, attack missile capability openly as never before.
*USA and the West economical leadership rebounded.
*Iran Islamist influence in Lebanon, Gaza , the Gulf states, Syria and other places is increasing exponentially as never before.
*Turkey following President Obama visit,under Endogen Islamist leadership ( Not Attaturk legacy), is enhancing the connections with Islamist Iran and many other Islamist activities.
*European NATO members lost their will to defend the free world and are decreasing their contribution to the defending forces.
*No Islamic leader has made a public speech in Arabic or Persian languages perusing for equality between world cults.

A great deal of the above list is the result of President Obama, the free world non leadership.
The charismatic president delivering well done speeches, CHANE- CHANGE- many disconnected from reality is leading were to?

The dictators and theocrats understood that the West is out of vision and leadership.

And they are on the march.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

If we keep trying to talk to Pyongyang and "give peace a chance" then this behaviour will simply continue. Next time it might be another naval vessel, or a tourist, or an airliner. The time has come for the liberal West to acknowledge that the DPRK is an evil, irrational, gangster regime, and no amount of talking will change it. How many lives have to be lost before the PC brigade admits that left-wing regimes can be bad too? Yes it has a very large military and it is dangerous. However, by doing nothing, the world lets the danger grow - basically, it's appeasement. So there needs to be some kind of physical action against the country. Knock out their nuclear plants, airbases, etc. And close the borders, especially the Chinese border. Peking needs to realise that if it wants to be a Great Power, then it has to take some of the responsibility for disciplining its errant brat. And without China on board, the UN can't do anything anyway.

Any action should try to stop short of all out war. A slap on the wrist, yes; a major punch up, no. And there needs now to be urgent consideration by the interenational community of how this basket case of a country can be reconstructed when it collapses. Again, China is the key player here. It is in China's interest that North Korea is a stable and secure state. I don't think the South wants the cost of rebuilding the North so it has to be an international effort.

There are no easy answers here. Partly because the problem has been left to fester since 1953. Perhaps if McArthur had been allowed to have his way we wouldn't be where we are now.

F.A.O. the left Re: Iran.


===================
in_the_uk wrote:

For all the nutters wanting every country to have nukes, this is why responsible people say no.

I don't know the exact island that was hit, but according to BBC Five Live, the South Koreans had been holding manouvres off thewest coast of presumably Formosa. Might it be less provocative to hold these manouvres off the east coast? or are they held off the east coast to be provocative to the North Koreans. I think that the Americans probably consider this as unfinished business. The north Koreans could well look at this in the following manner; the S. Koreans are backed up by a nation that will invade other nations @ the drop of a hat, namely the U.S. Hopefully diplomacy will avoid this going any further. As for the idiot who said 'Nuke em' Visit Horoshima or Nagasaki. Surely our nation is better educated than to come out with potty comments like 'Nuke Em'Must have ben educated @ a public school, like Cameron they usually come out pretty thick.

Why are we so worried about this. We have Russia, USA, India, Australia, Canada, France and pretty much the whole of europe on our side. If the Korea's want to have their scuffle then let them but right now its none of out business and we shouldnt be woried in the slightest. Korea wouldnt dare fire at us or any of our other allies for that matter, so lets just calm down.

Strike 1 sinking a korean ship
strike 2 firing artillery at a military base


who knows what strike 3 will be but if it happens it is war i dont think S korea will let 3 go unpunished.

i just hope when it happend everybody justy lets S korea get on with it alone.

the rest of the world should provide backup support like USA did for UK in the falklands not by putting men on the ground as this would provoke china.

(if china is still willing to protect them then china needs taking out) i would still fancy USA + europe to beat russia or china anyday. they have the numbers but we have the planes weapons and techonogy advantage.

1 man with a heavy machine gun could kill 100's of men charging at him with assault rifles.3 euro fighters or raptors woudl easily beat migs etc bombers.

if japan can do what they did to china ww2 if you compare size and the fact japan were fighting the usa aswell then i dont see why everybody think numbers are everything

Nuke 'em ? China would never allow that or let us get away with it, nor does it have any particular reason to stop them in the first place, so we'll have to find a more intelligent solution. Unless you want the world to end that is. There are more solutions between appeasement and attack, but it takes something filling the space between the ears to understand that. One step would be to speed up the reunification process, driven by the UN and China. Time Obama earned his Peace Nobel Prize.

I just returned from S. Korea two days ago after my twelfth visit in two years. The colleagues in Seoul whom I count among my friends continue to display a studied indifference to the North and all its dangerous antics. It's not unlike how the people who live below a dam refuse to acknowledge the risks by making any preparations or plans in case of emergency.

From a stress-control standpoint such denial is the only way to go on with daily life, but it's also not unreasonable, given how these cross-border skirmishes have been going on now for nearly two generations. I liken the behavior (and cognitive function) of the Kim family to that of Brittany Spears, who is deathly afraid of falling off the front page of the newspaper. Kim Jong-il is just publicly shaving his head in a desperate attempt to gain our attention.

I think former two presidents who were dead already should be responsible for this attack because they patronized socialism and helped North Korean regime to fortify their military forces! Now I geuss more than 100,000 brainwashed South Korean followers and North Korean spies live in South Korea to overturn this current government in the tricky and freaky name of Human rights or Equal distribution based on socialism!

This evidences the danger of unstable regimes being allowed by all parties to gain Nuclear power.

China and the US need to hang their heads in shame.

Maybe we could sell the North Koreans a aircraft carrier. Isn't that how to do things? Sell anyone anything then have a fight with them and get all our weapons fired back at us.

5. At 11:43am on 23 Nov 2010, Jamie Cole wrote:
"1 . At 11:23am on 23 Nov 2010, Kuradi Vitukari wrote:

Nuke 'em!"

I'm sure you're not being serious, but just in case other people follow your line of thinking - what about the poor subdued normal North Korean citizens who had no part in this nor likely agree with it?

Should other countries have nuked London for the decisions Labour made?!

////

Just how big is that crowbar of yours?

Assuming these shells are from the NKR, it shows how desparate they are becoming. I still wouldn't put it past the US to stir things up though!

After all, they sacrificed Pearl Harbour to get into the act in WW2, they stirred up Vietnam & of course, they've had their fingers in Korea already. Please don't tell me Pearl Harbour was a surprise attack - too contrived & neat!

How about some sort of international commando force, trained in the best secret invasion techniques, to go in there and quietly disable all the nuclear facilities? I know I'm being an armchair strategist but I just cannot believe the international community doesn't have the necessary resources. I suggest a close liason between (say) Mossad, MI6, GSG9, SAS, the Green Berets, whoever. The main thing is get them under a single coordinated command let them do their job. Above all, DON'T tell the bloody politicians till it's too late for them to meddle with their silly PC-ness.

12. At 11:54am on 23 Nov 2010, Ariely wrote:
The World picture - Analyzing individual cases masks the global picture and is misleading.

*N Korea aggressions and is increasing NUC capability are done openly as never before.
*The Islamists are on offensive in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, and Somalia as never before.
*Chaves is trying to create a NATO type organization of dictators and Theocratic.
*Iran is increasing the NUC, attack missile capability openly as never before.
*USA and the West economical leadership rebounded.
*Iran Islamist influence in Lebanon, Gaza , the Gulf states, Syria and other places is increasing exponentially as never before.
*Turkey following President Obama visit,under Endogen Islamist leadership ( Not Attaturk legacy), is enhancing the connections with Islamist Iran and many other Islamist activities.
*European NATO members lost their will to defend the free world and are decreasing their contribution to the defending forces.
*No Islamic leader has made a public speech in Arabic or Persian languages perusing for equality between world cults.

A great deal of the above list is the result of President Obama, the free world non leadership.
The charismatic president delivering well done speeches, CHANE- CHANGE- many disconnected from reality is leading were to?

The dictators and theocrats understood that the West is out of vision and leadership.

And they are on the march.

------------

im terrified at the thought of all that old outdated equipment against the latest and best wepon technology on the planet......

seriously they have numbers thats it, the usa and europe have more planes
whoever owns the skies wins the war.

russia has more tanks than anybody. good luck sneaking all thoese across russia into europe without anybody noticing

china has 1 bn people but they dont have the best equipment just because of the size .

iran and the middle east LOL

i think if they tried anything with the west would be very stupid for them.
israel is just itching for an excuse to wipe the floor with iran and egypt etc i think israel could probably take the middle east on its own as irans equipment etc look at iraq that about how much of a threat middle east countries are.

oh and ofcourse they would be atacking in the name of islam etc

but as the defenders we will have a reason to fight and something worth fighting for (freedom and our lives)


so bring um on its about time we wiped the floor with the ME and china russia is finally seeing sense so there fine

25. At 12:07pm on 23 Nov 2010, W Fletcher wrote:
Assuming these shells are from the NKR, it shows how desparate they are becoming. I still wouldn't put it past the US to stir things up though!

After all, they sacrificed Pearl Harbour to get into the act in WW2, they stirred up Vietnam & of course, they've had their fingers in Korea already. Please don't tell me Pearl Harbour was a surprise attack - too contrived & neat!

///

I am not saying I don't believe you, but could you please provide proof for the Pearl Harbour allegations?

23. At 12:05pm on 23 Nov 2010, Alba Al wrote:

Maybe we could sell the North Koreans a aircraft carrier. Isn't that how to do things? Sell anyone anything then have a fight with them and get all our weapons fired back at us.

---------------------------

No. For example vietnam was supplied with russian weapons to defeat the US. Just as the russians were beaten by afghan because the US supplied them. If the supported country turns on its ally after that can only be known over time. But your claim is obviously daft

People are going to die. Why does it seem that nobody cares about that?

5. At 11:43am on 23 Nov 2010, Jamie Cole wrote:
"1 . At 11:23am on 23 Nov 2010, Kuradi Vitukari wrote:

Nuke 'em!"

I'm sure you're not being serious, but just in case other people follow your line of thinking - what about the poor subdued normal North Korean citizens who had no part in this nor likely agree with it?

----------------------------------------------

Whilst I have a great deal of sympathy for the average citizens of North Korea. Sitting around waiting for the rest of the world to solve their problems is hardly helping is it? Much like every other nation on earth faced with living under an oppressive ragime, it is down to the average citizens of North Korea to take their leaders in hand and affect change.

The rest of the world cannot always be expected to pick up the tab in humna lives and cost to rid countries of their despotic overlords.

If this keeps on escalating, I guess we might be spending Christmas floating around somewhere in the upper atmosphere.

Good on 'em. Get stuck in!!

Obviously the most important thing is to keep a cool head and not let an incident that has cost two lives escalate into something that could cost thousands more. There are people who would dearly love to see this happen and they must be thwarted.

"I just returned from S. Korea two days ago after my twelfth visit in two years. The colleagues in Seoul whom I count among my friends continue to display a studied indifference to the North and all its dangerous antics."

Maybe they realize something we don't - that the chance of it ever escalating above a border skirmish is pretty slim.

Key question is whether it should be war now or after they have a useable nuclear capability.

The island in question is in disputed territory right off the North Korean coast. The South Korean exercises are a definite provocation so am not surprised the North exchanged artillery fire. The islands should belong to them as any sane person looking at the map would agree. Since the South is controlled by the Americans, this provocation can only have occurred at America's bidding. The BBC as usual is asking the wrong questions.

The North are externalising the internal problem, so something serious is happening inside the country that needs 'a good day for bad news' approach.

The South has massively more to lose from escalation so 'limited response' will be the order of the day, hunkering down for political & media purposes, and waiting whilst the UN and China pull on the dog-chains to bring us back to stand-off.

There will, of course, be no apologies for killing the odd person, etc.

1. At 11:23am on 23 Nov 2010, Kuradi Vitukari wrote:
Nuke 'em!

With comments like that, it's no wonder North Korea continues to develop Nuclear weapons!

Let them talk to each other and sort out their problems, the west should stay out of it!

If you keep 'fighting yard dogs' like China does with the North Koreans, then you expect them to eventually go mad .... its up to you to put them down when they do, or you can expect someone to come to do it for you.

China and Russia should stop playing cold war politics and sort North Korea out, preferably before World War Three.

I want to see if:

The U.N shows half the outrage with north Korean aggression that they do when Israel or the U.S defends itself

2. How many of the ignorant protesters in Europe come out and protest North Korea.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

"Nuke 'em"??????

How easy to say that in the comfort of your own home eh. Wouldn't be so nice if you were a North Korean citizen, who has no chance of a better life and who lives in one of the most oppresive regimes in the world. Seeing comments like that makes me ashamed to be British at times. Us Brits care nothing of other people - we're among the most selfish people on the plant.

With regard to North Korea, I think it's perhaps time to lay aside the moral and legal concerns regarding covert action and assassinations. I believe that rather than making innocent people suffer, covert operations should be put in place to remove the North Korean leadership. It'll be hard to change a population that has been brain washed for decades however. Many people genuinely love the leader and believe he is divine. It'll take a long time to re-educate those people but what on earth would be the good of 'nuking them', apart from causing more death, suffering, bad karma and a legacy worse than that left by Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

I wish a few people in this country used their brains a little more - wishful thinking....

We should all send our prayers, dedicate our mediitations or just (as I shall) send our wishes for peace to this troubled area and its suffering people. I hope our leaders have learned the lessons of the consequences of conflict.

Certainly a few challeged so-called worldly informed bloggers today! Any major conflict in this part of the world will involve hundreds of thousands of military personnell and arnaments (As with oil that make money then so to do arnaments) with the result of a great number of innocents being harmed most of whom are largely ignorant other than what each respective North or South government choose to tell their citizens. It is the DPRC that holds the key in this region, and well overdue to be turned! Shorterm, both sides should stop having military manouvers in disputed areas, only causes further tension. The DPRK must be at least allowed to feed, home and provide utilities that can be used safely for its citizens, not so long ago the DPRK was moving albeit slowly in the right direction unfortuately it was nearer to the end of the Great Leader KIM IL JONG time of influence when they mostly listened to the DPRC and the USSR (Gorbachov).

North Korea does what China tells it to do...just like we do what the the USA tells us to do.

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

It's a very worrying business, this is the sort of aggression that we should willingly become involved in, not the stupid Iraq/Afganistan wars. Unfortunately due to these ill conceived expeditions we and quite probably the USA will have no stomach or resources to intervene. North Korea has become far too dangerous to allow to continue the way it is bahaving.

There's a lot of hand-wringing nonsense being spouted on here for a change. These skirmishes happen all the time and will lead to nothing at all. Has everyone forgotten the exchanges of fire which took place earlier this year and every other year, and the sinking of the South Korean navy vessel, all of which led to precisely nothing?

On another note, I'm not sure why world leaders are immediately blaming the NKs without any evidence of who started it, especially as it only emerged later in the day that the South had been firing srtillery in the area. Jumping to conclusions much? And very convenient ones too:

Last week NATO declared its missile defence shield plans would go ahead. This is a programme nobody wants, needs or can afford. CONVENIENTLY, over the weekend the Americans report that NK has a new nuclear processing facility which is then used to whip up a media storm about WMDs, despite the American scientist saying the facility was clearly for civilian power generation. Then today, CONVENIENTLY, NK 'attacks' SK, showing what a terrible threat they are to world peace. Someone's playing us but not all of us are the blind sheep they think we are...

Are the Anti War Brigade going to come out and protest against N.Korea actions or they going to wait till America gets dragged into it so they protest against America as per usual.

2. At 11:27am on 23 Nov 2010, Upemall wrote:
Looks as though Kim Jong-Il has a son whose balls have finally dropped. Pity the boy has no brain to balance this advance into a thwarted adolescence.

It's time the world hit back at these outrages.
___________________________________________________________________

There's a lot of flippancy here, but underlying that is a very real point. Beware of the spoilt child who throws his rattle out of the pram!

Can't Hollywood make another film involving puppets?

ok its like this, as in the original Korean War, N Korea is the lapdog (a vicious little one at that) of China, and you can not do nothing to this lapdog with out china's say so, just like when the thousands of Chinese soldiers laid dying at the hands of the Glorious Gloucester s in Korean War Mk1, so it would be again if we did anything about it. the only answer is let S Korea to its fate, its a strategic game that seems to be unfolding at the moment, China has ambitions, in S Korea, Taiwan, Japan, and the rest of S Asia. maybe we should just give it to them? as I dont think one British soliders life is worth dying for it.

53 - SGD

I think you're wrong to regard N. Korea as China's lapdog today. The North must be a real embarrassment to the current leadership in China, who are not so stupid that they would risk wholesale nuclear war over nothing.

50. At 12:37pm on 23 Nov 2010, panchopablo wrote:
Are the Anti War Brigade going to come out and protest against N.Korea actions or they going to wait till America gets dragged into it so they protest against America as per usual.

///

Yes. If you spent some time thinking, you might even understand why. You don't necessarily have to agree, but at least you'd know what you're talking about and what exactly it is you don't agree with.

What do we get from North Korea except threats and blackmail? If any of us had a child who threaten others or their parents, that kid would be immediately in therapy to knock his provocations out of him. What do we do with North Korea? Detente? Let's be kind to them. Let's give them the soft approach. Haven't we been doing that for greater than fifty years, with the result that it's time for them to shell an island in a turnover of power to say to the world "Hands off, we're tough"?

Other countries usually celebrate a turnover of power or regime with a dinner or some fireworks. North Korea celebrates with new uranium enrichment centrifuges and the bombardment of some small island. How about that for leadership and a global role model? Let's hear from all the complainers about whether a Tory or Labour government is better. No comparison with NK!

World War is acoming, war always follows a depression, can we beat the "Evil Dragon" China, no I don't think so, better get your Chairman Mao suit ordered from the Tailors and wave goodbye to freedom!

>> 7. At 11:45am on 23 Nov 2010, Bauer wrote:
>>There are only 2 reasons I believe we have not "liberated" North Korea.

>>1. They have no oil
>>2. They share a border with China so we do not want to risk upsetting >>them.

Check your history. We tried to liberate it before and were pushed back out of North Korea in the longest retreat by American forces in history by a Chinese army using inflitration tactics and moving by night. We controlled the air but weren't able to hold off attacks that came from three sides with overwhelming numbers. We managed to hold them eventually which led to the North becoming a brutal left wing dictatorship and the South becoming a brutal right-wing one. Democracy came to South Korea in the 1980s after a student was tortured to death but the North is still totalitarian. I would have thought the answer was to do what we do with China which is open up all trade with them and allow the trade and wealth created to push political change from within. Using military force will just ensure thousands of innocent deaths on both sides which are totally avoidable and create a bitterness that will lead to future conflicts. China is key here though and has it's own interests to prevent the North Korean refugees crossing it's borders.

50. At 12:37pm on 23 Nov 2010, panchopablo wrote:
Are the Anti War Brigade going to come out and protest against N.Korea actions or they going to wait till America gets dragged into it so they protest against America as per usual.
----------------------------------------------------

Never a truer word spoken...

Assuming these shells are from the NKR, it shows how desparate they are becoming. I still wouldn't put it past the US to stir things up though!

After all, they sacrificed Pearl Harbour to get into the act in WW2, they stirred up Vietnam & of course, they've had their fingers in Korea already. Please don't tell me Pearl Harbour was a surprise attack - too contrived & neat!

--------------And 9/11 was a CIA plot and the moon landings took place in Texas and JFK was assassinated by Marilyn Monroe and Elvis Presley

Don't you just love a good conspiracy. No need for evidence and far more entertaining than the truth.

Very worrying. And some of the infantile gung ho nonsense I'm reading on this thread ios equally worrying.

However, there's nothing that Britain should be doing - we don't have the resources.

At 11:55am on 23 Nov 2010, Profcynic wrote: "...There are no easy answers here. Partly because the problem has been left to fester since 1953. Perhaps if McArthur had been allowed to have his way we wouldn't be where we are now."

I understand it was because of MacArthur's arrogance and ignorance we lost the war.. Creating the situation we have today. He pushed too far up the peninsula towards China and ended up kicking the communist dragon in the face.. The UN had won until China came in to protect its borders.

So who did really fired the first shot...
This saga of the North against the South has been going on since the Korean War finished as a ceasefire...so really it has yet to finish...and I do not see the North Koreans giving up while they have the regime they have and NO I do not want to see the Gung-Ho! Americans escalating us into another one of their wars against terrorism...the Chinese Government must be as sick as the rest of the world with the whole situation that doesn't diminish as the years roll by...It could escalate to all out war, but lets hope not and I for one fear if it does - that some hot head will attempt some Nuclear activity.
Either way it matters not at which extreme end of the Political Spectrum a Communist or Fascist Regime is...they usually care nothing for the Canon-Fodder they use or Strike Against...
What will happen next...

I hope this will finally awaken the world to the fact that China has an actual responsibility to the rest of the world to step up to the plate and take responsibility for helping negotiate with their ally (N.K.)to stop this kind of outrage. It is not enough for China to sit back and wash their hands of any involvement while they are actually knowingly being used and even seen as a potential backup big brother for the North Koreans. All the while the Chinese are simultaneously propagandizing any aggression by other western countries as wrong.... talk about a win/win situation ... and continually building up their military .

Straight out of "The art of War" by Tzu... dominate by doing nothing. This however could all backfire on the Chinese and N.K. themselves with a real measurably damaging conflict unless they are more pro-active.

To those who are advocating the UN get involved my response is do I start laughing now or later.

Can we not just Nuke North Korea and save the rest of the world a real headache?

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

49. At 12:37pm on 23 Nov 2010, bigoll wrote:
There's a lot of hand-wringing nonsense being spouted on here for a change. These skirmishes happen all the time and will lead to nothing at all. Has everyone forgotten the exchanges of fire which took place earlier this year and every other year, and the sinking of the South Korean navy vessel, all of which led to precisely nothing?

On another note, I'm not sure why world leaders are immediately blaming the NKs without any evidence of who started it, especially as it only emerged later in the day that the South had been firing srtillery in the area. Jumping to conclusions much? And very convenient ones too:

Last week NATO declared its missile defence shield plans would go ahead. This is a programme nobody wants, needs or can afford. CONVENIENTLY, over the weekend the Americans report that NK has a new nuclear processing facility which is then used to whip up a media storm about WMDs, despite the American scientist saying the facility was clearly for civilian power generation. Then today, CONVENIENTLY, NK 'attacks' SK, showing what a terrible threat they are to world peace. Someone's playing us but not all of us are the blind sheep they think we are...

--------------------------------------------


ok thats your opinion let me ask you this:

what if your wrong?

once a nuke has gone off you cant turn back time.


thats the issue do you let NK get nukes and take the risk? or sort them out now and eliminate that risk?

not is NK bad etc NK IS BAD it is EVIL there more interested in looking tough than stoping there own people starving to death.

if the leaders are willing to do that to there own then im afraid i dont hold out much hope they will play nice with any of us

I live in South Korea. It's incredibly aggravating when the North stages unilateral attacks like this. (I was also living here in 1996 when nothern commandos invaded by submarine). The problem is that a (perhaps long overdue) attempt to eliminate the northern regime would pose a serious threat to China, which does not want a pro-western country on its border. 'Nuking' the North, tempting as it might sound, would indeed be the beginning of world war III.

This is no more than a border skirmish. Making more of it must be agenda led even if I am not aware of the agenda.

Good to see that the UN is looking at talking about it it in a few days, and that Mr Obama was woken up at 4am. Things are really getting ramped up when the US Prez is woken up and the UN starts muttering about having talks! What next?!!!! The tension is palpable as the handbags start flying!

Actually, North korea has nothing to loose comparing to the South korea.South korea is tolareting them since a long time.I think, that give the courrage to north korea to be more aggrasive.This is time to give them some reply, So that they never dare to do so.

Damal
Ajou University,
South korea

Richard Blake- Inje University,Gimhae, Korea- I think it's game over.This is not a cry, but a scream for help from some subversive members of the party in NK. A House of Cards to fall anytime soon.Big changes and sooner than we think.

Fall of the Rice Paper Wall.

Kuradi Vitukari wrote: Nuke 'em!

****************

You know NOTHING.

North Korea has a military capability large enough to engage the U.S and its allies in total war. Western media portrays They have the world's fourth largest army. The world's 3rd largest stockpile of chemical weapons. The world's 3rd largest stockpile of chemical weapons, and a huge arrray of weaponry along the DMZ, inlcuding VAST artillery well within range of the 24.5 million metropolitan area of Seoul. They could flatten Seoul and obliterate the American military bases in Munsan, Pochun, Ding-gu-chun, Paju, and Yijong-bu in a matter of hours.

System F wrote: Under Bush, there was real progress with N. Korea. Under Obama, N. Korea, Syria and Iran do whatever they want and bomb whoever they want.

****************

You also know nothing.

Following Bush's description of North Korea as "the axis of evil" (a title which the regime deserves) North Korea resumed its nuclear weapons program and conducted its first nuclear test. Following further sabre rattling from his administraton, they conducted their second nuclear test, and tried to capture an American spy plane.

Brilliant progress

The only real way to solve the problem is to pressure China into withdrawing support for the regime, (which would then collapse), and come to some agreement that ensures no U.S military bases are established in the united Korea.

The French and Italians are already fitting the white flags to their tanks, and they aren't even involved!

My my my, the web warriors are out in force today.

Screaming garbled incoherent noise as they charge into cyberspace. Keyboards at the ready, they march proudly on. Attacking any evil doers they come across and generally making the world a better place.

the joys of a proto fascist mind state. Able to truly believe humanity can murder its way to the future. What a state of bliss you all must exist in.

On the actual issue, what is my reaction? Oh, I don’t know, how about war? That what people want isn’t it? A war they will play no part in fighting (apart from their cyberspace commitments obviously). A war which will not directly affect them apart from the ego boost they receive knowing that might is right.

In reality, as long as China continues its support of the North nothing will happen. And China WILL continue to support the North, its main buffer between it and its number one rival. But don’t let me stop you fantasizing about death and destruction. I am sure another conflict will crop up for you all to salivate over.

Sometimes I struggle to believe I am related to such humans. But then I remember that without such people I would not appreciate all the good people I come across.
So thank you, your pointless rage and hate filled arguments remind how not to act each and everyday.

So the North Koreans just lobed a few shells for nothing? They woke up yesterday and fancied risking war for no reason? You are a fool if you believe media and Government propaganda. Do you not think it funny how we only have one side to this story? Come on idiots wake up!

Not to support NK's actions but I think it's fairly clear that SK were firing shells into the sea off NK (west from Yeonpyeong IS NK) during their excercises. This may not excuse the North's actions but it's clearly the provocation.

41. At 12:28pm on 23 Nov 2010, MagicKirin wrote:
I want to see if:

The U.N shows half the outrage with north Korean aggression that they do when Israel or the U.S defends itself

2. How many of the ignorant protesters in Europe come out and protest North Korea.

The main difference, though, is that we expect totalitarian lunatics to do stupid, aggressive behaviour. We don't expect that of democratic countries that uphold the rule of law.

Oh my god, its the Australian's turn! They are getting their surfboards out and firing up the barbie!!!

66. At 1:00pm on 23 Nov 2010, simon wrote:

Can we not just Nuke North Korea and save the rest of the world a real headache?

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Cant do that to the palestinians so no we cant do it to N.korea. Would prefer a peaceful outcome but thats up to the N.koreans

62. At 12:57pm on 23 Nov 2010, PoliticalChindit wrote:
At 11:55am on 23 Nov 2010, Profcynic wrote: "...There are no easy answers here. Partly because the problem has been left to fester since 1953. Perhaps if McArthur had been allowed to have his way we wouldn't be where we are now."

I understand it was because of MacArthur's arrogance and ignorance we lost the war.. Creating the situation we have today. He pushed too far up the peninsula towards China and ended up kicking the communist dragon in the face.. The UN had won until China came in to protect its borders.

It was MacArthur advocating using nuclear weapons in Korea that got him fired.

Sam Kim in Seoul has just returned from a quick meal and the streets are peaceful. Thank God!!!! The South Korean President is passing the buck saying the NKs must take responsibility....Duh!!!!
Is it me, or is this a load of handbag-wielding nonsense?!!!
Leave the idiots to it!!

11. At 11:50am on 23 Nov 2010, Magi Tatcher wrote:
I suggest that we leave it to China, Russia, Japan and the USA to sort out.

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A lot of people in the USA said that about Hitler and leaving it to Europe to sort it out.

69. At 1:01pm on 23 Nov 2010, CRE wrote:
I live in South Korea. It's incredibly aggravating when the North stages unilateral attacks like this. (I was also living here in 1996 when nothern commandos invaded by submarine). The problem is that a (perhaps long overdue) attempt to eliminate the northern regime would pose a serious threat to China, which does not want a pro-western country on its border. 'Nuking' the North, tempting as it might sound, would indeed be the beginning of world war III.

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If I understand correctly, the main reason there are 2 Koreas is because after WW2, Russia and the US couldn't agree on one government, resulting in the current situation. I am wondering, and maybe as an insider you may know about this, what is happening with the reunification process that has been talked about so much?

maybe those commenting have no idea where korea is in relationship to japan, china, usa pacific territories (hawaii), russia or other pacific nations. get an asia pacific map before making such ignorant comments.

many are affected by n. korea's instability. we are not south asia . . . or the middle east. there is a huge difference between what is going on there and what is going on here. there is a huge difference between south asia and east asian pacific nations. exception, those being colonized by britain . .. over 100 years ago.

we are in east asia, and kim's son is crazy affecting all of us and our security.

A very serious and disturbing incident. Since the North orean navy most likely sunk a South Korean naval ship killin sailors, the communist North has been spoiling for a fight with its southern neighbour and ultimately the US.

Together with Iran, North Korea must be the most belligerent state in the world today. It is a tyrannical, failed communist dictatorship, which has invested solely in nuclear technology, with a view to acquiring the N bomb. Its people, many of whom flee to the free South, live as prisoners in what is in effect a giant prison camp. There is constant famine and dire poverty asa direct result of the regime's failed policies. There also concentration camps, torture, slave labour and executions of North Koreans by the communist party, especially those that follow a religion.

This will be an unwelcome development for the Americans as they're tied up in Afghanistan and Iraq. The onus will be on Washington and Beijing, North Korea's only friend, to reign them in and prevent the clash from escalating.

There is also a historical legacy here. The fact that the UN failed to overthrow the Stalinist North, thanks to the intervention of the peoples' republic, means that the Korean Peninsula stands constantly on the brink of war. This will only change when the communist government in the North finall collapses.

The UK is the only country in Europe to permit North Korea a consulate. After this continuing acts of 'war' by the North this should be closed andtheir ambassador and staff booted out and not allowed to return.

I am a British National in Uijeonbgu City North of Seoul. Early this afternoon we saw aircraft flying high in the sky towards North Korea. Something we have never seen before. There were buses full of soldiers on the roads. Many people are worried here that this could be the start of a major conflict. Worry times.

Western media portrays North Korea as weak militarily, but it is not.

Anyone know when Stop the War coalition are planning to protest North Korea's actions?

Get your Hyundai car spares before the factories either get bombed out or turned into weapon factories.

Is this really a worry to the UK? and why would we want to send any of our forces over there? Sit back and stay out of it for once.

It's probably all America's fault, I should think.

Or maybe Iasrael's fault.

Am I the first one to suggest this?

Richard Blake- Inje University,Gimhae, Korea- I think it's game over.This is not a cry, but a scream for help from some subversive members of the party in NK. A House of Cards to fall anytime soon.Big changes and sooner than we think. Fall of the Rice Paper Wall.

68.
"ok thats your opinion let me ask you this: what if your wrong? once a nuke has gone off you cant turn back time. thats the issue do you let NK get nukes and take the risk? or sort them out now and eliminate that risk? not is NK bad etc NK IS BAD it is EVIL there more interested in looking tough than stoping there own people starving to death. if the leaders are willing to do that to there own then im afraid i dont hold out much hope they will play nice with any of us".

No nukes are going to go off. Please do inform me of any time in history since the atomic bomb was first tested and, several days later, deployed to end WW2, that nukes have been used. Even at the very height of the Cold War nobody pressed the button.

Do we let let NK get nukes? Time to bone up on your current affairs - NK has had nukes for a few years now but lacks a reliable delivery system.

Is NK evil? Is it really? Have you been there? Do you know any North Koreans? I've no doubt Kim Jong Il is a nutter but what exactly has NK done in the past 50 years which could be considered 'evil'? Nothing.

NK might be a bit nuts but Kim isn't stupid. He rattles his sabre now and again to get the attention he needs to gain concessions in talks. He's not about to doom himself by attacking anyone sufficiently to garner a major military response.

Like I said originally, there's a lot of ill-informed hand-wringing nonsense being spouted on this board for a change.....

This comment was removed because the moderators found it broke the house rules. Explain.

89. At 1:16pm on 23 Nov 2010, left-wing-blogger1 wrote:

Western media portrays North Korea as weak militarily, but it is not.

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I dont think the media emphasizes the capabilities even though it has mentioned some. The fact that they are trying to develop nukes and ICBM's is a problem. They are also unpredictable which adds to the problem.

But this isnt israel so the media wont sensationalise it.

Japanese state television is running endless commentary and analysis on the crisis, whilst ministers are 'collating information'. Interestingly, nobody has openly come out and criticized North Korea for this latest incident.

When seen in the wider Asian-Pacific context, Japan is still licking its wounds following recent political clashes with China and Russia over disputed island territory. You get the impression that the government here does not want to get involved any more than it has to in this crisis, quite possibly because it will come under pressure to voice a strong condemnation of the attack in line the US. This only fuels the fire of anti-Japanese sentiment that China is cooking up

Oh good another war for us to stick our nose in and have a good bash at a cost of billions and pointless loss of lives. Haven't we done this one before? Ah well we did Afhfanistan before and that made no difference either!

What is my reaction to the incident?
Another false flag operation.
What repercussions could the clashes have in the region and the rest of the world?
I hope independent investigation.
How can North and South Korea resolve their differences peacefully?
Work together to find out who carried out this false flag operation and make every effort to expose this country for what it is - a warmonghering nation, needing war to feed its military/industrial complex.
North's military insists it did not open fire first, but who will believe that? Who will listen? China will listen, perhaps even Russia, but the EU and the UK will knee-jerk the Americans.
Dig this: On Saturday, it also happened to emerge that North Korea was showing off what it claimed was a new uranium enrichment facility to an American scientist. To an American scientist? What was an American scientest doing inside North Korea - at a new uranium enrichment facility?
The move prompted the US to rule out the resumption of six-party talks, which were never going to happen anyway because "war" is the economy of the Americans. An emergency session of the United Nations Security Council could be held on Tuesday or Wednesday. I'd like to hear this session - another American attempt to form a coalition of the willing - based on lies. It's happened before, but parts of the world are slow to learn, while other parts are in cohoots.
North Korea's shelling of Yeonpyeong island constitutes a clear armed provocation...against those persons responsible. Furthermore, its reckless shelling of civilian targets is unpardonable - against those persons responsible.
26 March: South Korean warship, Cheonan, sinks, killing 46 sailors
False flag and never proof-positive brought to conclusion.
China: both countries should "do more to contribute to peace". "What's imperative now is to restart six-party talks as soon as possible."
Russia's foreign minister did not automatically blame North Korea; rather, Russia said: those behind the attack carried a huge responsibility.

55. At 12:47pm on 23 Nov 2010, Boo Hoo Britain wrote:
50. At 12:37pm on 23 Nov 2010, panchopablo wrote:
Are the Anti War Brigade going to come out and protest against N.Korea actions or they going to wait till America gets dragged into it so they protest against America as per usual.

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Yes. If you spent some time thinking, you might even understand why. You don't necessarily have to agree, but at least you'd know what you're talking about and what exactly it is you don't agree with.
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Understand what? That most of the anti-war brigade are nothing but traitorous cowards and hypocrits? Happy to allow regimes like North Korea to spend decades making slaves and paupers out of their people, but any attempt to resolve or solve these issues by the US or the West is jumped on, with hords of unwashed, self rightous, placard waving idiots roaming the streets.

You people make my stomach turn... You are beneath contempt