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Last Updated: Monday, 4 October, 2004, 12:17 GMT 13:17 UK
Do shops provide enough disabled access?
Wheel chair user having difficulty opening doors
Shops, restaurants and other businesses can now face legal action if they fail to provide access to their premises for the ten million disabled people in Britain.

The Disability Discrimination Act requires all service providers to take "reasonable" steps to ensure that disabled people can use services offered to able-bodied people.

ASK THE EXPERT
Bert Massie, Chairman Disability Rights Commission answered your questions in an interactive forum.

But a survey by the Disability Rights Commission - published earlier this week - suggests that 4 out of 5 high street shops still haven't made the necessary changes.

Are High Street stores doing enough to cater for people with disabilities? Will small businesses be able to cope with the new laws?

This debate is now closed. Read a selection of your comments below.


The following comments reflect the balance of opinion we have received so far:

A step forward for humanity and decency in Britain
Pat, London, England
This is one of those things like taking children out the mills or giving women the vote, that'll ruffle a few feathers but be a step forward for humanity and decency in Britain. Any of us could be in a wheelchair through an accident, and callous words about minorities have no place in our society.
Pat, London, England

Though I am disabled I feel laws of this sort can be counter-productive in that they mandate often very expensive alterations for virtually no reason. Few disabled people can afford to drive, dine out, much less shop in high end markets yet parking spaces, lifts and such are created and then go unused. The solution I would like to see is one where each individual business be allowed to create accessibility that is based on demand by actual customers thus minimising the expense where it would be unnecessary.
Daniel, San Francisco, Ca, USA

I have had to walk with a stick for the last 6 years due to a balloon accident when I was 20. People forget that access to buildings is not simply a matter of a ramp for wheelchairs.
Karl Franzmann, London, UK

This is an issue which needs care. I have seen conversions in small shops that make them accessible to a wheelchair but in doing so add some small obstacles which are a danger to other able bodied but frail shoppers. It has to be accepted that wheels and legs cannot always be accommodated together.
Al, Aylesbury

I really hope this is a wake up call for ALL businesses
Mike, Barnet
I cannot believe how selfish and ignorant many people's attitudes are on this site. I have a disabled friend who cannot use railways, buses and many shops, when he tries to ask for help he is made to feel like a peculiar little man, just as he always has. I really hope this is a wake up call for ALL businesses - and those that don't comply should face the wrath of the law.
Mike, Barnet

Having recently taken over as Area Manager for a well known retail chain in central London on Tuesday, I was concerned to receive a phone call on Friday from a shop that had misplaced their copy of the discrimination act. I called another shop to see if they had a copy I could photocopy and was told they had also 'misplaced' it. Further calls to another 18 shops established that not one of them had been instructed to safely file the document and only 4 of them knew what was required of them. I will now be spending the next week getting everyone up to speed on this important legislation which potentially could have serious consequences for the company if not correctly implemented.
Pete, London

People talk about a disabled minority, but the population is getting older. and will continue to do so in the future. We may be glad of these laws one day! As people have said here, people with young children in buggies will also benefit. We are only talking about "reasonable" steps anyway.
Rob, Birmingham, UK

The DDA is about basic courtesy to fellow humans
Ken, Scotland
It's depressing to see responses making comments about "silly rules" and "helping minorities". The DDA is about basic courtesy to fellow humans who are less fortunate than most of us - and, because of the "reasonable adjustment" proviso, firms will NOT go to the wall because of it. Unlike other "minority" groupings which are normally defined at birth, we are all at risk of becoming partially or wholly disabled at some point in our lives. Those so dismissive of the Act should maybe think about that! All it takes for an able-bodied person to become disabled is a car accident, an illness or, even, simply growing old. Perhaps if your more callous correspondents suffered that misfortune their attitudes might change.
Ken, Scotland

The simple fact is that someone with impaired mobility cannot do everything an able-bodied person can do. While it is fair to expect a certain level of access to everyday services it is also not surprising, when the law uses such vague terms as "reasonable steps", that small businesses in particular are afraid of what a judge might deem to be "reasonable". Small businesses struggle enough as it is in the face of the giant conglomerates and probably can't afford to take any chances at all of being sued by the more extreme cases who would have areas like the Lake District covered in tarmac so that wheelchair users could enjoy it.
Jonny, England

How many people who criticise these rules have tried walking around town with someone in a wheelchair? I said similar things until I met a friend who is in a wheelchair, and was amazed how many places are inaccessible that would never have seemed problematic to me before. Most of them only needed small changes that would not affect an able person's movement at all.
Paul, Bristol, UK

Shouldn't it be down to the businesses themselves as to what customers they want? If they choose to lose income by not providing premises which are disabled friendly that is their choice. It supply & demand. The only exceptions to this should be the likes of post offices, banks, public transport and supermarkets.
Bec, UK

I'm concerned that this Act is bereft of clarification of what reasonable adjustments would be.
Colleen Morrison, Harlow, England
I'm a small business owner and very deaf. I believe its long overdue that our society should have to make reasonable adjustments for people with disabilities. However, I'm concerned that this Act is bereft of clarification of what reasonable adjustments would be. Even the Disability Rights organisation admits that it isn't sure and that this will have to be tested in the courts. It cannot be reasonable for a small shop to be put out of business because the premises is structurally too small to make aisles wider without damaging its capacity to carry essential stock. Perhaps a notice offering an assistant's help should be sufficient, but will it be? The Government has drafted this new Act in negligent, vague terms which are causing substantial confusion and stress for small businesses and people with disabilities regarding what amounts to reasonable adjustments. The problems of small businesses should have been addressed with clarity. Also, I view the presumption of the Act and its interpretation by tribunals that there should be positive discrimination towards people with disabilities as paternalistic and demeaning to those of us who have disabilities, unfair to those who do not have disabilities and damaging for businesses. Having a disability does not give us the right to preferential treatment, nor does it give society the right to treat us like children and insult us with the paternalistic attitude that underlies parts of this Act. Above all else, those of us with disabilities wish to be treated with respect - as equals. Yet how can we ever be viewed as equals and respected when society presumes that we can only function if cushioned with positive discrimination and preferential treatment?
Colleen Morrison, Harlow, England

Many disabled people, quite rightly, receive grants, allowances & the like to try & help them cope: if the Government is serious with this Legislation shouldn't there be some form of cash assistance to help small businesses pay for these extra facilities for the disabled ?
Robin Saltonstall, Beverley, England.

These silly rules are being brought in to help a minority. What about the majority? If a small company had a choice and didn't comply then they would lose business from a minority, they would go elsewhere. Larger companies can afford to adapt, but smaller companies? If we lose our small independent traders through these laws then the majority will suffer, which in my book does not seem fair!
Wendy, Wolverhampton

Surely there needs to be some responsibility taken by local councils
Si Wooldridge, Darlington
Surely there needs to be some responsibility taken by local Councils on this legislation. A lot of small businesses lease their property and pay high rates for town centre business. Much as I welcome the legislation, if I was paying a large rate for a space, I'd want value for money by filling as much as possible with stock. It's pointless just expecting businesses to reduce their stock levels without doing something in return like reducing rates.
Si Wooldridge, Darlington, County Durham

People complaining about the effect this might have on small businesses in old buildings are forgetting that businesses are only required to take 'reasonable' steps. Try to read things before commenting on them.
Katherine, London, UK

Why not comply? It's either laziness, or conscious disrespect of people with disabilities. It's interesting that retailers don't seem to realize that people with disabilities shop, too.
Suzanne Griscom, Seattle USA

Surely there should be a balance between the needs of the disabled and the community. A local cinema here is to close because there is no practical way of installing a lift to the first floor lobby. Closure is preferable to the owners than the risk of prosecution. No one wins, the disabled still have no access to the cinema, and the able-bodied lose it also. So who does this law benefit?
Graham, Oxon

It is not the law that is the problem, it is short-sighted British management
Anon
As I write this I am working on my company's web site to make it comply with the disability laws. I told them 18 months ago it was required, they did nothing until 3 weeks ago when a customer said they would not use us unless we were compliant, so panic ensued. It is not the law that is the problem, it is short-sighted British management.
Anon

Minorities are what make up a diverse democratic society. Everyone is unique or different in one way or another, so everyone should be given a fair chance to access the same goods and services.
Jackie Davie, Arbroath, Scotland

This new law is very welcome as high street stores do not currently do enough for disabled people. They should have the same rights and access to services and products as everyone else. As a short person I find shopping a challenge sometimes. Reaching items is near on impossible on high shelves or deep shelves. As for small businesses, they should do the same to cater for people with disabilities, maybe the government could offer grants to companies who would struggle with the expense?
Sian, Ipswich, UK

Part of my business is concerned with human equality and I also have a disability so I welcome the new laws. However my experience (personal and professional) in the past when trying to use the both the Sex and Race Discrimination Acts is that they were far too complicated and toothless even for courageous complainants. I fear that the DDA will fail those who need it most in the same way.
Hilary Traveller, Guildford, UK

I can only imagine how difficult it must be for a wheelchair user when there is no ramp or lift
Richard Taylor, Basildon, UK
While there may be many shops that have poor disabled access, spare a thought for those disabled commuters who can get on to trains now, but can't access the platform itself! I have on many occasions helped mothers with pushchairs up large flights of stairs to exit my local station, but I can only imagine how difficult it must be for a wheelchair user when there is no ramp or lift. There is no excuse for this, it is purely ignorance on the part of the operators.
Richard Taylor, Basildon, UK

Whilst not wanting to sound selfish, I think it is terrible that so much money should have to be spent on making places accessible to a minority. Big chains are one thing, but smaller stores should not be forced to spend a fortune on putting in ramps and lifts which will very rarely be used any way.
Dave, Slough, UK

Dave from Slough: 2 years ago I'd probably have been guilty of making similar 'selfish' comments. Since then I've been diagnosed with MS, restricting my mobility and giving me a new perspective. I understand that some businesses cannot make major changes due to financial or structural reasons, but the point should be that they are not given 'carte blanche' to not even bother investigating whether there are any smaller changes they can make to make their premises accessible. Before asking why they should spend money when they don't have any disabled customers, maybe they should consider whether this is because their premises are not currently accessible!
Neil, Durham, England

More costs for the small business on top of everything else. Many will not be able to do the alterations purely on the confines of the buildings, should they be closed because of that?
John Davey, Burbage, England

I welcome the changes because as the father of a 20 month old daughter I have experienced first hand the poor accessibility of a lot of our high street shops. Shops where the aisles are too narrow for a pushchair and where the children's section is stuck up on the top floor with no though given to how shoppers with pushchairs gain access to it. I appreciate that a lot of older building cannot be economically modified but some better though in product placement would go a long way.
Steve Allen, Stevenage

In general life is easier for many disabled people now than it was 10, 20 or 30 years ago
Pennie Forthem, Uckfield, East Sussex, UK
I have been disabled all my life, and can tell you that in general life is easier for many disabled people now than it was 10, 20 or 30 years ago. The DDA is a huge step forward, but we are living in cloud cuckoo land if we believe that it will change society and attitudes towards disabled people overnight. It won't. But it does pave the way and make it easier to put our point of view across.
Pennie Forthem, Uckfield, East Sussex, UK

Once again, we all have to change by law, to accommodate a minority. I run a small pet shop, and if I comply with these laws, I would have to remove the centre shelf fitting from my shop, to allow room for people in wheelchairs. This would reduce my stock by 35% so 99% of my customers are then unable to purchase the products that they want, because the space has to be available to accommodate one or two infrequent shoppers who will probably still expect me to do everything for them anyway, as I did before!
Steph, Sleaford

On my way into work I saw a cafe sign that has changed in the last week. The management have obtained a portable ramp that they will use for those who can't manage the small step in and they have commissioned a Braille menu. Little changes like this can't be unreasonably costly and can only make life easier for people.
Tim, Fareham, UK

I would love to see a country that is friendly to all people regardless of disabilities
Elaine, UK
I must admit I had not thought much about disability access until earlier this year when a back problem flared up which meant I needed a little help with walking and getting about. Sadly where I live in Camberley, Surrey the buses are not suitable for someone with limited mobility. I would love to see a country that is friendly to all people regardless of disabilities - unfortunately it seems to be the able bodied who will make the decision whether this will happen.
Elaine, UK

I am ashamed to say that I did not realise how awkward our high streets are until my father was confined to a wheelchair. Never mind actually getting into the shops/cafes/offices, just moving along the street can be like taking part in an assault course! And most ironically of all, in our small market town the shop which sells disabled aids, wheelchairs etc can only be entered by negotiating two steep steps!
Linda, UK

In my previous job I regularly took a teenager out around her town in her wheelchair. Many shops had a single step leading up to them. Even some of those with ramp access were arranged on split levels with just a few steps between the two. Aisles were ridiculously narrow. But it's not just the shops. The town itself was poorly arranged. Every few yards we had to cross the road because the pavement ended. Medical science has advanced so that more people with greater disabilities are given the gift of longer life. Yet once they are brought into the world we are making far too little effort to accommodate them within our society. What is wrong with us?
Sally, Sussex, England

Maybe business owners should be made to spend a week confined to a wheelchair to see the difficulties faced by disabled
Lisa, Glasgow, UK

I think it's terrible it's taken this long to change the law. My cousin is a wheelchair user and everyday life is difficult. Taxis won't pick him up because they have to lift his wheelchair. They stopped the wheelchair friendly buses in his area and a day out shopping has to be planned with military care. I'm surprised at some of the comments made here - people seem to be hung up on cost and not quality of life. Maybe business owners should be made to spend a week confined to a wheelchair to see the difficulties faced by disabled.
Lisa, Glasgow, UK

All these people who say that firms will be put out of business or that the law cannot be complied with in old buildings are talking nonsense. The law only requires "reasonable adjustments" - and a change isn't reasonable if it is impossible or it would bankrupt the country. Are you saying that firms shouldn't make adjustments for their customers even though it would be reasonable for them to do so? So much for serving the public.
RK, London, UK

We have to wait until a few test cases settle what "reasonable steps" means. Until then many businesses will do nothing until they understand what their minimum requirements are?
Matthew, Oxford, UK

Since the government is demanding the changes, they should also be footing part of the bill
Vivien Cooksley, Vienna, Austria
The changes need to be made and its great that they are being made. Still, since the government is demanding the changes, they should also be footing part of the bill. Specially when it concerns small businesses who cannot handle the changes costs on their own.
Vivien Cooksley, Vienna, Austria

What else can be done without getting silly? As a manager of property I know how much these changes cost to make and how extreme the interpretation of the law is being made. I imagine that to change older shops or factories would put small firms out of business. By having a legislation which is too powerful, the state may find that firms avoid employing disabled staff because to comply will cost them too much and is so counterproductive to the disabled community.
John, Watford, UK

We used to own a pub and restaurant - a 16th century building! When we enquired about placing a ramp at one of the doors, the local authority responded with extremely precise slope angle requirements and flat landing area dimensions. A ramp to that specification was not possible, without moving the building! A very slight (and extremely practicable) variation would have enabled the construction. The authorities' response - if we don't construct to precise specification, then we would be breaking the law. End result - no ramp.
Paul B, Oxford, UK

Facilities for disabled people in the High Streets are appalling. This is typical of the grab and greedy society established in the 80s. This new part of the Disability Discrimination Act is belated but should be welcomed. If the small businesses find it difficult to cope with the new laws they must realise that it is a necessary expense and manage their businesses accordingly. Black cab taxis are single ownership and they are forced to comply with disability laws.
Raymond Rudaizky, London U.K.

It is right and proper that the law says reasonable adjustments - that way businesses that can afford to make improvements do whilst ensuring that local small businesses aren't wasting 75% of their shop on the off chance that someone in a wheelchair comes in
Ed, London

No they don't and it's about time that they started. It's absolutely disgraceful that in this day and age that disabled people's needs are greatly ignored or at the very least put to the bottom of pile. It should be made law that every high street shop, restaurant or public amenity provide decent disabled access.
Nick, St. Ives, UK

When a shop or shopping centre does provide lifts, why is it that able bodied people use it instead of taking the stairs, thus freeing up the lift for disabled people and those pushing prams and pushchairs?
Ian, UK

I think that shops do provide enough access. Off hand, I cannot think of a single premises in my high street that would cause problems for a disabled person to enter. Of course, some shops do have restricted layouts but then again, floor space is a very precious commodity and the manager of the business must decide whether it makes sense to provide larger areas of empty floor space for wheelchair accessibility or to provide assistance when required.
Toby, Surrey

Could all businesses please note that induction loops only help deaf people when they are switched on! And if you only have one loop in your bank or post office, cinema, supermarket, or railway station, please could you ensure that that window is staffed! Thank you.
Hester, London, UK

I welcome these measures, not because I am disabled, but because I am a parent with a buggy
John Warburton, Borehamwood, UK

I welcome these measures, not because I am disabled, but because I am a parent with a buggy. There are many many parents out there who have for years struggled with doors and stairs, where was the legislation to make their lives easier? The problem is that although the shops etc. will make their doors wider and their steps lower, they do nothing inside about the narrow aisles, tight corners and access to cash desks that make life difficult for ALL "wheeled" users.
John Warburton, Borehamwood, UK

A lot of the big high street stores try to do a good job with providing disabled access, but has anyone noticed that the toilets are always on the highest floor right at the end forcing everyone to trek all the way up and disabled people waiting ages for a lift.
David Hilton, Hudds, UK

Small shops will have trouble affording these improvements when disabled people are a tiny percentage of the community and their custom. They should not be force to make themselves accessible.
Matthew, Enfield

While I have every sympathy for the disabled this new law is totally inflexible. Many shops/restaurants are conversions of hundred year old buildings. The architecture makes it very hard to fit ramps or lifts, yet this is not taken into account. Shopkeepers are faced with being bankrupted by the cost of conversion or prosecuted for failing to comply.
Peter, Nottingham (U.K)

Peter, Nottingham, disabled people don't want your 'sympathy', they want the ability to go about their daily business without constantly having to ask people for help. My father has to conduct his banking on the street with an assistant from the bank coming out to deal with him. No privacy there. Equally, we have to put up with people 'tutting' as he struggles through checkouts and down aisles in shops. The sooner businesses are forced to be fair, the better.
Kate, Blackburn, England





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