Transcript David Cameron interview

PLEASE NOTE "THE ANDREW MARR SHOW" MUST BE CREDITED IF ANY PART OF THIS TRANSCRIPT IS USED

THE ANDREW MARR SHOW

INTERVIEW:

DAVID CAMERON

PRIME MINISTER

OCTOBER 2nd 2011

ANDREW MARR:

… about his life and career at the South Bank Centre in London on Wednesday. When he first told his mother he was thinking of running, she replied: "That's nice, dear. President of what?" I'm sure my next guest didn't get that kind of reaction when he told his parents he was going to run as Conservative Party Leader. David Cameron, welcome.

DAVID CAMERON:

Good morning.

ANDREW MARR:

You're apologising to women.

DAVID CAMERON:

Yes. I mean (sighs) I obviously said some things in the House of Commons that you know just came out wrong and caused the wrong impression and I deeply regret that, and I was asked about it in an interview with The Sunday Times and I just said what I think.

ANDREW MARR:

So you're a new man really? Women can relax. You're not patronising, you're not old-fashioned. You're new, you're modern?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well I mean this is not an excuse, it's an explanation, but the House of Commons … Prime Minister's Questions is very aggressive, confrontational. That's what Prime Minister's Questions is like and I don't think you can change it actually, but as a result sometimes it just … it sounds terrible. And so I apologise for that. That's not what I'm like, it's not who I am, and I wanted to try and put that right. But I recognise you know must do better.

ANDREW MARR:

Right. And what about some of the policies towards women - things like there's been an argument about women's pensions and there are all sorts of issues on child benefit and so on. Are you conscious that perhaps women voters are not quite as supportive of the coalition as others?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well I think there's a deeper underlying issue here, which is that you know Britain faces a very difficult time right now, as countries right across the world do. Families in Britain see petrol prices going up, they see food prices going up, electricity increasing. Many people who work in the public sector have had a pay freeze and you know at the heart of many families are women who are worrying desperately about the family budget. And this government has to do difficult things. I profoundly believe we're taking the right decisions to get the country through to better times ahead, but as we make those decisions, we have to explain really carefully why we're doing what we're doing. But I think that's probably had an impact on families and on many women and that causes great concern. And I understand that. We've just got to do better at explaining why this is necessary.

ANDREW MARR:

Well let's talk about the economy because clearly I mean there's news of another bank in trouble in the south of Europe, people very, very worried about the future of the Euro itself. How bad do you think things may get in the year ahead?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well clearly there is a real problem in the Eurozone and we've got to deal with that problem. I think the outlines of what needs to be done are becoming clearer all the time. The British government has a very clear view, a view that we're pushing with partners in Europe, with the IMF, with others about what needs to be done: strengthening the financial mechanisms in Europe, greater involvement for the IMF, facing up to the debts and the problems and dealing with them decisively. This is what needs to happen because frankly right now the Eurozone is a threat not just to itself but also a threat to the British economy, but a threat to the worldwide economy, and so we have to deal with this.

ANDREW MARR:

Do you agree with George Osborne that actually there has to be in effect a single European economy with a single tax system, single fiscal system and all the rest of it? You can't have a currency without all the rest of it?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well the problem with the Eurozone, the logic of having a single currency is it leads you in that direction.

ANDREW MARR:

Yes.

DAVID CAMERON:

That's always why I wanted us to stay outside the single currency, and as long as I'm Prime Minister or Leader of the Conservative Party, we are not going to go into the Eurozone. But I think the crisis …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) But those on the inside have to follow that logic now, do they?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well I think they do, but it's more than that because it's actually more urgent than that, which is that action needs to be taken you know in the next coming weeks to strengthen Europe's banks, to build the defences that the Eurozone has, to deal with the problems of debts decisively. They've got to do that now. They've got to get ahead of the markets now irrespective of the changes the Eurozone might choose to make in the future about having a more single economic coordination, which I suspect they will need. There are more urgent steps that have to be taken more quickly.

ANDREW MARR:

What happens to us if the Eurozone breaks up?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well it would be very bad. I mean you know one of the reasons why we want the Eurozone to deal with its problems is the facts for Britain are pretty clear: 50 per cent of our exports go to other European countries; 40 per cent go to the Eurozone. If bad things happen in the Eurozone, that affects us. You know we can't hide our … we can't insure ourselves against the fact that right now the German and the French economies, the two biggest economies in Europe, have stalled. That is a real problem for us. So we want them to deal with their issues and problems; we're being helpful in that way. But let me be clear. You know I will always defend the British national interest. Now I think our interest is to be in the Europe Union because we need that single market - we're a trading nation, it's vital for our economic future - but I've always made clear my view that we've given too many powers to Europe and there are some powers I'd quite like back from Europe and there may be future opportunities to bring that about. (Marr tries to interject) But the crisis, the problem for Europe right now is dealing with the Eurozone problem. That is where all our energies should go because we've got to solve this problem in order to get the world economy to grow again.

ANDREW MARR:

So let's be absolutely clear. You would like to see the repatriation of powers from the EU?

DAVID CAMERON:

Yes, that was in our manifesto …

ANDREW MARR:

Absolutely.

DAVID CAMERON:

… that's what I believe. I mean obviously in an …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) So when the House of Commons votes (as it now will) on a referendum on Europe, you will be voting for a referendum?

DAVID CAMERON:

No, the issue of a referendum, it's not our view that there should be an in/out referendum. I don't want Britain to leave the European Union. I think that would be a …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) But why not give people a choice, give people a chance?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well I think it's the wrong answer for Britain. What most people want in this country, I believe, is not actually to leave the European Union, but to reform the European Union and make sure the balance of powers between a country like Britain and Europe is better.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Well sorry …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) That's what people want.

ANDREW MARR:

On this, it's perfectly possible that the commons could decide to vote on the idea of a referendum on the repatriation of powers and going back to the kind of trade association that we used to have with Europe, not a simple in or out. That kind of referendum presumably you'd be in favour of?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well, no, let's see. The whole reason the House of Commons is able to have a vote is because of a very bold reform this government made, which is to say let's give the House of Commons more power over its timetable, the ability to debate and discussion subjects.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Sure. But which side would you vote on …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) Well let's see what debate, let's see what subject they choose, let's see what question is put down. This is what parliament ought to do. It should have these greater freedoms. Let me just say once again, Andrew, because it is … You know the government's priority right now: sort out the Eurozone; get the European economies growing again. Let's for heaven's sake get the single market working properly because there's huge things we could do in Europe to help promote growth in Britain: get a single market in energy, finish the single market in services, open up European markets, make sure that we stop the costs that are being piled onto British business through the European Union, let's stop all of that. And I'm not a pessimist …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) But to do that, to do that …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) This is really important. I'm not a pessimist about this.

ANDREW MARR:

Yeah.

DAVID CAMERON:

In Europe, Britain actually has been able under my government to build some very strong alliances. This year we've got France, Germany, Britain saying let's freeze the European budget. We've managed to get Britain out of the Euro bailout mechanism. That's a treaty that's going through Europe right now that gets Britain out of the bailout mechanism that Labour got us into.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Okay, but …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) So I'm not a pessimist about Europe, but I do think we can do better.

ANDREW MARR:

At this moment of economic crisis for Europe, it is very likely that there will have before long to be some kind of treaty renegotiation and a revised treaty. The Germans and the French and people have been talking about a new shape to the European economic system. That is an opportunity for there to be a renegotiation of this country's relationship with Europe and possibly, well certainly also a referendum because you have promised that.

DAVID CAMERON:

I think you are getting slightly ahead of things because two points. One is the Eurozone issue is the urgent priority. That's what needs to be dealt with. Second point is there is a European treaty that's happening right now. This is the treaty that gets us out of the bailout mechanism that Labour got us into. Prospect for further future treaty change is not an immediate prospect. What we've got to do is make sure we sort out the Eurozone issue in a way that protects Britain's national interests …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Alright, but just in terms of …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) … and I think that is the priority. For the longer term, I've been very clear on this programme and said I think we gave too much power to Europe, there are some powers I'd like to get back.

ANDREW MARR:

Right.

DAVID CAMERON:

Any future treaty change would be an opportunity to do that, but right now that's not on the immediate agenda.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) But you would …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) I don't think I could be any clearer than that.

ANDREW MARR:

Alright, perhaps one more time: you would relish the opportunity of a treaty change which allowed you to renegotiate our relationship with Europe, repatriate powers, and have a referendum in this country?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well I wouldn't quite put it like that …

ANDREW MARR:

Why not?

DAVID CAMERON:

… because what I would relish right now is for European leaders to roll up their sleeves, get the single market working, sort out the Eurozone, get our economies trading, working and growing. People in rooms up and down Britain aren't thinking gosh, if only we could have a treaty change in Europe. They're thinking get the economy moving, get jobs going in this economy. That's what my leadership's about, that's what this conference is all about. I mean one of the biggest things we're talking …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Okay, well let's get onto …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) Okay, yuh.

ANDREW MARR:

… let's turn onto this because it seems to me there are three possible ways of getting the economy moving. You could cut taxes. You're not going to cut taxes, are you, in this parliament? George Osborne has said so.

DAVID CAMERON:

What we're not going to do is put at risk the very clear plan we have in place to deal with our debts and our deficit, which is absolutely vital to give people confidence the government is going to get this economy under control. And it's vital for …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Which means that you can't cut taxes.

DAVID CAMERON:

What it means is that you can't suddenly tear up your borrowing plans and your debt plans because it's those plans that give us the low interest rates that are absolutely key for economic recovery. And you know elsewhere in Europe those countries that don't have a plan, they see their interest rates going up 5, 6, 7, 8 per cent.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) No, I understand the argument.

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) That would be devastating for our economy, so line one of …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) I understand the argument, but I'm just …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) Absolutely …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) So you can't cut …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) So don't deviate, don't deviate from …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Okay, so you don't deviate. You can't cut taxes. You can't say right, we're going to slash taxes to get the economy moving. The next thing, the next thing you can do …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) What we have done, by changing priorities, is we have cut corporation tax. We've got one of the lowest rates of corporation tax coming anywhere in the advanced world, so you can make changes.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) But you can make these … We can argue about this, but you know overall.

DAVID CAMERON:

Okay.

ANDREW MARR:

You could spend lots more money and you're not going to do that for the reason that you've just said. There are some infrastructure projects which are going ahead - highly controversially the fast railway line between London and Birmingham, for instance - but again you can't spend huge amounts of money, you can't do an old-fashioned sort of Keynesian job creation system, can you?

DAVID CAMERON:

Again what you can do is make sure you're spending money on productive things, and this government is spending more on capital projects than the last government plan. You can protect the science budget, which is what we are doing. But again you shouldn't put at risk the overall picture of getting the debts and the deficit under control.

ANDREW MARR:

Okay.

DAVID CAMERON:

Let me just make this point because I think it's important. Those people who argue you know a few more billion now would make all the difference, I would make this point to them. You know over the next four years, we're going to be spending over three trillion pounds, the government, into the economy. Is it really a good risk to spend a few more billion now and potentially put at risk the low interest rates that are so key to your economic revival?

ANDREW MARR:

Sure, I do understand …

DAVID CAMERON:

I think you know that's a very important point to get across.

ANDREW MARR:

I do understand that, but if it's not going to be done through those sort of traditional ways, I mean you could potentially print your way out of trouble, you know use inflation to help a bit and that seems to be going on with the Bank of England at the moment.

DAVID CAMERON:

Well I think you're missing the two, in your growth …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) I'm working through them.

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) You're working through them. Let me explain what the growth strategy is. Line one is deal with the deficit, absolutely essential for low interest rates. Line two is do all the things to make it easier for businesses to start up, for businesses to grow, for business to employ people, to expand and to invest. So we're dealing with the employment regulations, we're cutting corporate tax, we're dealing with things like business rates, we're reforming the planning system.

ANDREW MARR:

And yet …

DAVID CAMERON:

All of these things …

ANDREW MARR:

Okay.

DAVID CAMERON:

… and overall since the election, there are half a million new private sector jobs. So the economy is rebalancing between more private sector jobs and having to deal with excessive spending in the public sector.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) But you must be very …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) It takes time and it is difficult, but that is … The key to a growth strategy is are you making it easier for business to expand, to grow, to invest? And we are.

ANDREW MARR:

But you know that we are at a very, very dangerous moment here; that the world economy is in terrible trouble, the hope of exporting our way out of trouble is more problematic than it used to be because of that. Andrew Tyrie - senior Conservative, Chairman of the Treasury Select Committee - says that your growth strategy is "incoherent" and "inconsistent" and it needs to be "pulled up several notches and made more serious".

DAVID CAMERON:

Well, first of all, let me take the export point because actually if you look at, for instance, our exports to China, they're up 40 per cent, so we are seeing some export led growth. If you look at … Take one industry that I've spent some time with in the last year, which is the motor industry. You know you look at Jaguar Land Rover - massive expansion and a new factory in the Midlands; you look at Honda, at Nissan, at Toyota.

ANDREW MARR:

Yeah.

DAVID CAMERON:

You know we are a massive now exporter of cars and car engines and that industry is bringing more of its supply chain on shore. I think that's making a big difference. Let me answer the question about Andrew Tyrie.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) You need to reengineer a growth strategy, bring it forward a bit?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well we need to do everything we can to you know set the fires under the engines of … Sorry, that's a bad metaphor. Let me try again. We need to do everything we can to fire up the engine of the British economy. Now Andrew Tyrie's got lots of …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) So a step change, a step change?

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) There's a step change taking place right now. You can see for instance in what I'm talking about today, the housing market. The housing market isn't working. Why isn't it working? Because of the debt crisis. The banks are bunged up with debt, so the banks aren't lending, the builders aren't building, and the buyers can't buy because they can't get the mortgages that they need. So this government isn't just sitting back. We are rolling up our sleeves and saying right, we're going to make over government land to house builders …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) And they'll get it free?

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) … on the basis that they can build now and pay for the land when they sell the homes. That could build a hundred thousand homes, two hundred thousand jobs in our economy. We're not stopping there. We're saying let's bring back the right to buy your council house with proper discounts that Labour got rid of, and let's use that money as young people choose to buy their council home, let's use that money to build homes for rent, for low rents for families that are currently stuck on the housing list.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) There aren't that many council homes left, of course …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) There are, there are. No, there are …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Most of them social housing and housing associations.

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) No, that's not the case. You know over two million homes I think are still available to be bought. So this is something that can make a big difference and again that could provide another hundred thousand homes, another two hundred thousand jobs. So taking those two policies together, that could be two hundred thousand extra homes, four hundred thousand extra jobs.

ANDREW MARR:

Now of course your enthusiasm for more houses and more homes - and Shelter talks about three million houses being needed by the end of this parliament, so much more - but your enthusiasm has put the government into confrontation with organisations like the Campaign for Protection of Rural England and the National Trust who are very, very worried about the new national planning guidelines for England, which they say is going to destroy the green England that you grew up with and I, you know many other people know so well.

DAVID CAMERON:

Well, look, I represent a constituency in Oxfordshire, the gateway to the Cotswolds - probably one of the most beautiful in the country with the most incredible countryside, beautiful forests and paths and all the rest of it. I would no more put that at risk than I'd put my own family at risk. I love our countryside. But I think everybody knows we have a planning system that's incredibly bureaucratic, incredibly complicated. And house building right now, it has increased from Labour's very low levels. Under Labour it reached the lowest level since 1924. The average age of a first time buyer without help from Mum and Dad is now 37. We've got to do more to get the homes built that we need for young people, increasingly not so young people in our country. And we can do that without jeopardising the green belt and the areas of outstanding natural beauty and the rest of it. We need a simpler plan …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Well let me be very specific about that because we read that in the national plan - and everyone understands that it's been far too bureaucratic, the system in the past, and too lengthy and too complicated - but under the new system, there is going to be no limit on where, for instance, hoardings and advertisements can be placed. There won't be special areas of outstanding natural beauty or particular counties anywhere. You will be able to stick up hoardings in fields and stuff all around the country and people look at this and say it's going to be like the worst parts of the United States …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) No …

ANDREW MARR:

… some of the worst parts of the third world.

DAVID CAMERON:

Look, I don't accept that at all. One of the things we're doing because we're trying to slim down …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Is that wrong?

DAVID CAMERON:

That is wrong because we're slimming down the national guidelines. And I think some people assume if you don't mention something in a national guideline, that just means that local authorities will not be able to stop unsightly development. That's nonsense. I think we need to trust local authorities more. I think if we stand back from this, I would put it like this. Why is it at the moment people tend not to support development? Frankly, I don't blame them because local communities don't get much benefit from new development. Under our new plans, if the factory goes ahead in your local area, you keep the business rates, you can spend the money; if new homes go ahead in your area, you're going to get the new homes bonus, you can spend that money for the good of local residents. What we need to do is create a system where local people see the benefits and yes of course the disbenefits of planning and housing and factories and jobs going ahead. That would be a more rational system where I think we'll get greater sustainable development in ways that people feel comfortable with.

ANDREW MARR:

And yet as a result of this change, there is going to be a great deal more housing in rural England? That's true, isn't it?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well if you take … Let's take a constituency like mine. As I say, beautiful villages, beautiful countryside. Actually in the last five years we've built an extra three thousand houses. I don't accept that local politicians don't want extra housing. They do if you can do it …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Well politicians may. I'm talking about residents.

DAVID CAMERON:

They are voted for by local residents. You know villages in our country, if they were able to be in control of having a few extra homes, they know that would be good for the local pub and the local village school. This is a really important point.

ANDREW MARR:

(over) So you simply think the National Trust and Bill Bryson have got it wrong on this?

DAVID CAMERON:

Of course they're expressing their concerns. That's their job and it's our job to listen to their concerns, and if there are concerns that need reflecting of course we'll reflect them. The point I'm trying to make is a really important one, which is today, under the existing planning system, the local village and the town fears the arrival of the huge extra housing estate sort of plonked on its margins.

ANDREW MARR:

Yes.

DAVID CAMERON:

If you give local people more control about what sort of houses, where do they go, how many, I think we can have a more rational debate about planning in this country and we can see our villages become places of life with a future for the village school, the pub and the post office rather than a slow death.

ANDREW MARR:

The Home Secretary wants to see the end of the Human Rights Act: gets in her way terribly, we've all read the stories about suspected terrorists who can't be moved from this country and so on. Do you agree with her?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well I do agree that it would be good to replace the Human Rights Act with a British Bill of Rights. That was the Conservative policy at the last election. That is I think the right thing to do. We're in a coalition. In that coalition we have a very clear agreement to set up a commission to look at the idea of a British Bill of Rights, but obviously it will go more slowly than Theresa or I would want. Now are we going to just sit back and go tough, nothing we can do? No, not a bit of it.

ANDREW MARR:

So what are you going to do?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well one of the problems we have here is not just the Human Rights Act. It's the sort of chilling culture under it that means that someone drives a police van you know an hour, as it was the other day, to move a prisoner two hundred yards when he was perfectly happy to walk. The Human Rights Act doesn't say that's what you have to do; it's the sort of chilling effect of people thinking I will be found guilty under it. And I think the government can do a huge amount to communicate to institutions and individuals let's have some commonsense, let's have some judgement, let's have you know that apply rather than this sort of over interpretation of what's there. That's point one. Point two very quickly. Part of this comes from judgements in the European Court of Justice and we are now going to be chairing the Council of Europe. We have an opportunity with others to try and change the way that the ECH, the European Convention on Human Rights works, and we're going to try to get some commonsense in at that end as well. Would I like to go further and faster? Yes, I've said so. But I think in the meantime …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) If the Conservatives had their way, if you were governing by yourself, you would get rid of the Human Rights Act and replace it with a British Bill of Rights?

DAVID CAMERON:

Yes.

ANDREW MARR:

Now which leads us neatly onto relations with the other side of the coalition. Lots of rude things were said last week about the Conservatives. Tim Farron, the Liberal Democrat President …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) That was two weeks ago.

ANDREW MARR:

Two weeks ago.

DAVID CAMERON:

There were quite a lot of rude things said last week as well, but you know …

ANDREW MARR:

There were, yes.

DAVID CAMERON:

… these things wash over you.

ANDREW MARR:

It begins to blur at this point in the conference season. (laughter) Tim Farron talked about it going … it was a "ghastly" thing, this coalition, "bound to end in divorce" and so on. And yet, clearly, there are Liberal Democrats with whom you personally get on quite well, and I wonder whether if you did win an election in your own right with an absolute majority, you would push them all out or would you seek to have some of those people still working with you?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well, look, first of all I am focused on the here and now, delivering this government's agenda. And what I would say at a time of great economic uncertainty and difficulty in the world, it is actually good that Britain has got a strong and stable government and a government that is clearly in place until that election in 2015. I think that's a very important thing. I would pay tribute … Far from being rude about my coalition partners, I pay tribute to the fact that Conservatives and Liberal Democrats have had to put some of their differences aside and in the national interest have come together to deliver the sort of long-term change that the country needs. Of course there are tensions and pressures, but I think we are frankly grown up enough to deal with those and to deliver good government. So what happens at the next election - we'll fight as independent parties; we will be fighting to win; and whatever, as they say, whatever happens happens.

ANDREW MARR:

How the cards fall. What kind of Conservative are you because there's been a lot of debate, as you'll have known, in the newspapers? Are you really still a Thatherite core Conservative restrained and held back by coalition, or are you naturally a cuddly Conservative, a centrist Conservative who enjoys coalition?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well I would describe myself as a modern, compassionate Conservative. Modern because I think we've got to apply ourselves to the challenges of today. No good just looking back to your past. You've got to think about what is it you've got to do right for the moment. Compassionate because we mustn't leave people behind in our country. I think our deficit reduction plan is fair. The richest pay the most. We're trying to protect families on low incomes. But I'm a Conservative because I believe generally if you give people more power and control over their own lives, they will actually make great decisions. So that's the sort of Conservative I am. I don't believe for a minute that this government is only sort of held back by the cuddly Liberal Democrats. You know the decision to increase spending on the NHS throughout this parliament, that wasn't a Liberal policy or a Labour policy. That was a Conservative policy.

ANDREW MARR:

Does it frustrate you that the Liberal Democrats take so much credit for the popular policies and you get all the stick for the unpopular ones?

DAVID CAMERON:

No, look, it's … Look, it's our job. We both run different parties and it's our job to you know talk with our parties and to our parties about what we achieve in coalition. I think the Conservatives can be very proud of the fact that we have frozen the council tax, we've cut corporation tax, we're setting up free schools and academies across the country, we're bringing in the reforms we think this country really needs. There are lots of things the Liberal Democrats can be proud of and the success of one doesn't have to be at the disadvantage of the other, if you like.

ANDREW MARR:

But there will be a divorce eventually? I mean you're not going to stand down or …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) Well we're not married, so I mean there won't be … (laughs) I mean I don't … You know I don't …

ANDREW MARR:

You haven't signed the papers; you didn't get around to it?

DAVID CAMERON:

No, no, I am happily married, but to my wife, not to Nick Clegg if I can put it that way. (Marr laughs) But no, it's not a marriage, so it doesn't end in divorce. It is a coalition where two parties have put aside some of their own interests for the good of the country. We go into the next election as separate parties and I want to win outright a Conservative term. I think we can do even more great things for our country if we achieve that. But in the meantime, I've got a massive job of work to do: an economy that needs growth, a Europe that needs reform, a society that needs strengthening. There is a mass for us to do over this five year term.

ANDREW MARR:

We started by talking about the economy and that really is clearly the issue that's going to overhang the week entirely.

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) Absolutely.

ANDREW MARR:

Vince Cable talked about it being "like a war situation", as serious as that. This is a war time coalition government, but it's a wartime coalition government facing economic war, not physical war.

DAVID CAMERON:

Well there are elements of truth to that. I mean the last time we had a coalition government was in wartime and one of the benefits of coalition is you put aside some of your immediate interests to achieve long-term good. You're asking the country to try and come behind what the government's doing at a difficult time. The fact that two parties are making a defence of difficult decisions and you've got one completely outside of that consensus - and I think very, very backward looking as we saw last week at their conference - the fact that two parties are making these arguments is actually helpful at a time of economic difficulty. Which it is and it would be whoever was the Prime Minister.

ANDREW MARR:

I sometimes get the impression going round the shopping centres and looking around that although there's a lot of talk in places like this about tough times and the economy in deep, deep trouble, out there a lot of people still haven't really noticed - people are still spending, still wandering around. You know is …

DAVID CAMERON:

(over) I don't sense that. I think up and down the country people … You know I think one of the biggest shocks for people has been the electricity increases, the gas increases. Put that on top of what's happening to the family shop, what's happened at the petrol pumps, a lot of people in the public sector …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Are really hurting now.

DAVID CAMERON:

You know you see … Well the wage freeze is necessary. I think a lot of people understand that. But those things combined are making life difficult for people and the government … You know democracy is government by explanation. We are doing the right thing, but we've got to explain all of the time why it's necessary, how we're going to help people. And also what's at the end of this. You know …

ANDREW MARR:

(over) Well you've always kind of summed it up as an alliance man, you've always been an optimist, but things are bound to get worse before they get better, aren't they?

DAVID CAMERON:

Well things are difficult, but we need to explain to people what is it we're trying to build at the end of it. What does it look like. I'll give you … Yesterday I went to this hospital in Warwick and there was this really friendly old guy who was lying in bed. He'd hurt his back. And he was telling me how proud he was that he had three sons. One worked for Rolls-Royce making the best engines in the world for aeroplanes. The other was at Jaguar Land Rover - incredibly proud. And the third was at Shell. And he said, "You know I feel my boys are building Britain's industrial future." And I just thought what a wonderful way of putting … Now that's what we need for every family in this country - this sense that we're going to build an economy that's worthwhile. Not just worth something, but really worthwhile. And I think we can.

ANDREW MARR:

And if I ask you where is growth going to come from, how is this country going to earn its way in the world - industry, not simply financial engineering is the answer?

DAVID CAMERON:

Of course. Look we are brilliant inventors in this country. You can run through. We invented the jet engine, DNA, the Worldwide Web. We invent all these things and we don't always exploit them. And you know we've got the great universities, but we haven't had the technical centres, the apprenticeships, all of those things that we're now putting in place. And that's the vision we have to explain to people. There is something better at the end of this.

ANDREW MARR:

Alright, a big agenda, a big vision. Prime Minister, thank you very much indeed.

DAVID CAMERON:

Thank you.

INTERVIEW ENDS

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