thisworld Rwanda – A Killer’s Homecoming Tx Date: 22nd February 2004 This script was made from audio tape – any inaccuracies are due to voices being unclear or inaudible 10.00.00 This World Theme Music 10.00.05 Title Page thisworld 10.00.10 Music 10.00.24 Narrator Nine years after the Rwandan genocide, forty thousand killers are about to be released. 00.00.29 Music 10.00.38 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over My name is Theophile Ntaganda; I’m forty-eight years old. I’ve been in prison since September nineteen eighty-four. I was arrested because I killed my mother-in-law and my two sisters-in-law. I also killed a little girl. 10.00.57 Music 10.01.01 Narrator Theophile’s wife Odette ran for her life. 10.01.03 Music 10.01.08 Odette Voice over If someone confesses to a crime he should be punished. In my opinion a killer should be executed. 10.01.17 Music 10.01.21 Narrator Now Theophile is being freed and he wants his wife back. 10.01.25 Music 10.01.27 Title Page A KILLER’S HOMECOMING 10.01.35 Music 10.01.41 Narrator In nineteen ninety-four Rwanda was the site of one of the worst genocide’s of the twentieth century. Nearly a million Tutsi were slaughtered in a hundred days as the Hutu rampaged across the land. 10.01.52 Music 10.01.54 Narrator Neighbour turned against neighbour. Husband against wife. 10.01.58 Music 10.02.14 Narrator In his former life, Theophile was a photographer with his own studio and a happy marriage. 10.02.24 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I used to get on well with my wife, we never fought. We got on with all the neighbours regardless of whether they were Hutu or Tutsi. We didn’t have any problems until the genocide started. 10.02.46 Narrator Theophile is a Hutu but claims he was forced by soldiers to kill the mother and sisters of his Tutsi wife. 10.02.56 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over The soldiers lined up the victims pushing them with a gun barrel. I pulled the trigger and heard a bang. They fell to the ground and so did I. The soldiers took the gun and ran away. 10.03.11 Odette Voice over I remember my mother as someone who loved everybody. When she had a beer she’d share it around. She was respected by everybody. My younger sisters were well mannered and very beautiful. I was meant to die too but God protected me. 10.03.35 Music 10.03.37 Narrator Odette and Theophile have two children. Eleven year old Sharif and Kofi who is nine. They have little memory of their father but they’ve learnt that he was a sharp dresser and known as Biseruka – ‘the good looking one’. 10.03.52 Music 10.03.54 Odette Subtitles Kofi looks so much like his father, Theophile. What will you do when you grow up? Will you be a driver, a doctor, a teacher? 10.04.20 Kofi Subtitle I want to do that white woman’s job. 10.04.23 Odette Subtitle You want to be a photographer? Kofi Subtitle Yes. 10.04.26 Odette Subtitles Your father also loved photography. Do you remember when I told you… that your father is in prison? 10.04.38 Kofi Subtitle Yes. That’s why I’ve never seen him. 10.04.52 Narrator More than a hundred thousand prisoners are still waiting to be tried. It’s an impossible task for the courts. So the government has come up with an alternative. 10.05.01 Radio Subtitles Prisoners accused of genocide and looting… who have confessed, shown remorse and asked for forgiveness… will be released and re-educated. 10.05.23 Narrator Theophile is one of those who has confessed. It’s his only hope of getting out of prison any time soon. 10.05.36 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I’ve become very good at ironing prison uniforms. When I get out I wonder if I’ll be as good at ironing civilian clothes. The creases are so wonderfully sharp, they’d cut a fly in half, maybe even peel a pineapple. 10.05.56 Music 10.06.02 Narrator After Theophile’s arrest Odette wanted a divorce but he hadn’t yet confessed to any crime so the court rejected her request. She moved in with Theophile’s friend John, a fellow survivor of the genocide. 10.06.15 Music 10.06.19 John Voice over Odette and I used to work the land to grow our own food. Later I passed the entrance exam for the National Bank. When I started work I wanted to stop renting and build my own house. Eventually, if God helps us, we’ll do up this place, install water and sell it for a profit. Then we’ll buy a better place in a better location, not on the hill like this one. 10.06.55 Odette Voice over After the genocide many people hated dogs because they had eaten dead people. But we find them useful. There are a lot of thieves here and the dogs protect us. 10.07.12 Narrator Odette has built a new life with John. They now live in the capital, Kigali and have three children together. 10.07.26 Odette Voice over At weekends we normally just stay in and relax. We help the children with their homework. 10.07.41 Narrator But Theophile believes he and Odette could be reconciled – if it wasn’t for John. 10.07.47 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles You were my neighbours, so you know how we used to live… how happy we were. Even when I got arrested, she would visit me in prison. Until this man came along and put ideas in her head. Now she’s changed a lot. He’s the only one I’m scared of. 10.08.17 Narrator The first forty thousand killers are about to be released from prisons across Rwanda. 10.08.24 Prison official Subtitles The following people will be released… Kabera, Leonard… Ntaganda, Theophile. 10.08.36 Narrator But before Theophile returns home he and the other prisoners must go to a re-education camp. 10.08.50 Odette Voice over First he should pay for the suffering he has caused me, for my people whom he killed. I think someone who kills should never be forgiven. The one who has killed should be killed. 10.09.16 Music 10.09.31 Narrator After three months of re-education, the government hopes the killers are ready to be reintegrated into society. 10.09.51 Teacher Subtitles You have to prepare for how people are going to live together. We have to think about what happened in Rwanda. Genocide happened in Rwanda and people saw it. Some who are here, and others who escaped abroad. It’s time to look within ourselves… to find any barriers to our living together in harmony. 10.10.24 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over We’ve learnt about the history of our country and were taught the origins of segregation. And we learned how, when we go back to our villages, we’re going to live alongside people that we’ve wronged. 10.10.49 Song Subtitles This land was cursed. Rwanda, I pray for you. We welcome back the refugees who fled. We reach out to everybody. 10.11.21 Narrator After nine years as a prisoner, Theophile is on his way home. 10.11.25 Music 10.11.29 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I’m very happy because I’m going home. I have been a prisoner for so long, but now I’m free. I’m looking forward to seeing my children. 10.11.43 Music 10.12.05 Odette Subtitles If you saw your father, would you recognise him? Do you remember him? Would you be scared of someone who is a killer? 10.12.21 Sharif Subtitle I would. 10.12.23 Odette Subtitle Why? 10.12.25 Sharif Subtitles Someone who dared to kill people… other human beings, is a mean person. 10.12.41 Music 10.13.33 Narrator Theophile’s first stop on his journey home is at his father’s village. 10.13.36 Music 10.13.53 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles Come quickly, come and hug me, Daddy! How are you? What’s the news? 10.14.20 Father Subtitle Go and greet the others. 10.14.22 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles Of course, no problem. Are you ok? I didn’t think you’d look so well. You’re still strong. 10.14.31 Father Subtitle So are you. 10.14.34 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles Things have changed. I don’t recognise the young children here. Generally, I think everything has changed. The only person who is still the same is my dad. What about me, would you recognise me? 10.14.59 Father Subtitle Yes. 10.15.01 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles You see, I’ve lost all my hair. Look at you, you’ve still got yours. 10.15.10 Father Subtitle Maybe you were thinking too much. 10.15.21 Sharif Voice over He killed my grandmother and they put him in prison. After killing my grandmother he also killed a child. After they put him in prison my mother found John who is my father now. I feel I don’t have peace. 10.15.57 Narrator Kofi and Sharif’s future is at stake. Theophile doesn’t just have rights to visit his children, under Rwandan law he has custody of them. 10.16.10 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I’m going to the school to see my children. I missed them a lot. I hope I’ll get to see them. 10.16.44 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles Come and say hello! How are you? Do you know me? Don’t worry, look at me. Don’t you recognise me? Who do you think I am? How are you? Who do you think I am? 10.17.10 Kofi Subtitle Biseruka. 10.17.13 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles How did you know I’m called Biseruka? It’s me, your Dad - do you understand, my baby? I am your Dad. 10.17.35 Odette Voice over Legally the children belong to him because he paid a dowry for us to be married. The wife can go but the children always remain the property of the father. He can come and take his children from me and I have to accept that. But I wish they could stay with me. 10.18.07 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles Hello, how are you? How are you? 10.18.13 Sharif Subtitle I’m fine. 10.18.15 Theophile Subtitles Do you know who I am? Look at me, look at me. Do you know who I am? What’s my name? Who am I? Come over here. Don’t be afraid, everything is fine. What’s my name? 10.18.44 Sharif Subtitle Biseruka. 10.18.46 Theophile Subtitle Do you know how we are related? 10.18.53 Sharif Subtitle You’re my Daddy. 10.18.55 Theophile Subtitles That’s right, my son, I’m your father. You are my first born. Are you happy? Are you very happy, or just happy? I left a long time ago when you were very small. You were only 2 years old. Do you remember, when you were 2 years old? Are your studies going well? 10.19.39 Theophile Voice over I’m happier than ever before. Sharif is not at all how I imagined him to be. He has grown very big. Now there’s nothing in my heart except my kids. I feel very happy. I’m just waiting for the opportunity to take them home to live with me. 10.20.20 Sharif Subtitles He came to my school. They called me from class. 10.20.27 Odette Subtitle He came to your school? 10.20.28 Sharif Subtitle Yes. Odette Subtitle Did he hug you? 10.20.31 Sharif Subtitles Yes, he hugged me a lot. I knew it was him. 10.20.37 Odette Subtitle Did he ask you anything about me? 10.20.40 Sharif Subtitle About you? 10.20.41 Odette Subtitle Did he not ask about me? 10.20.45 Sharif Subtitle He didn’t even mention you. 10.20.49 Odette Subtitle He didn’t ask about your Mum? 10.20.52 Sharif Subtitles He just asked how everybody was at home 10.20.57 Music 10.21.19 Sharif Voice over We felt we loved him a lot but because of what he did to us we’ll only visit him and then come back here. 10.21.30 Interviewer What did you most like about Theophile? 10.21.33 Kofi Voice over His glasses. 10.21.40 Sharif Voice over He was good looking and he was wearing nice sunglasses but his trousers weren’t very nice. I didn’t like his trousers. 10.22.03 Singing 10.22.19 Narrator Peace and reconciliation between Hutu and Tutsi has been the rallying cry of Rwanda’s President, Paul Kagame ever since he liberated the country nine years ago. 10.22.30 Singing 10.22.34 Paul Kagame Subtitles We’ve encountered many difficulties. But everyone has united and we have solved many of them. We have been victorious. 10.22.47 Drums 10.22.52 Paul Kagame Subtitles We want to see Rwandans… working hard and using their intelligence… to make Rwanda… a better and more peaceful place for everyone. 10.23.13 Narrator The government hopes than an old tribal form of justice will help Rwanda’s reconciliation. 10.23.20 Narrator It’s introduced village tribunals; Gacaca Courts. Survivors confront the newly released killers, who must confess to all their crimes if they are to stay free. 10.23.32 Court official Subtitles It’s obvious that you participated in many killings. 10.23.39 Narrator Odette will have to confront Theophile in a Gacaca Court similar to this one. 10.23.44 Man 1 Subtitle Who forced you to do it? 10.23.48 Accused Subtitle Isidore. 10.23.50 Man 1 Subtitles He mobilised you and said… “Let’s go hunting humans and kill them.” And you agreed. Why were you going down the hill? 10.24.00 Accused Subtitles I was forced to. They could have forced you too. 10.24.04 Man 2 Subtitles This man is a liar. He’s lied all along. 10.24.10 Odette Voice over If they were punished I would be pleased but releasing killers from prison and have them live so near to you, when they’ve killed your whole family, looking at you mockingly, that doesn’t make me happy at all. 10.24.23 Interviewer Do you believe the Tutsi will ever be able to forgive and forget what the Hutu did to them during the genocide? 10.24.34 Odette Voice over We will not forget. Even here today I was sad; looking at those Hutu and wondering why they killed innocent people. 10.24.47 Music 10.25.10 Odette Voice over This is where my husband killed my family. He killed them right here, the three of them. They were shot and buried here. Later we took the bodies back to our ancestral land. 10.25.34 Odette Voice over It hurts so much to pass their grave every day because you can see our house from here. It’s so near and the soldiers brought them here. 10.25.55 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over This is where I used to live. It’s changed so much. You can’t really see it that well from here. 10.26.13 Narrator It’s Theophile’s first visit to the house that he and Odette lived in with their two children. 10.26.41 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I’m worried about living here; the place is a mess and I have to start from scratch. The roof is destroyed; rain will get into the house. The kitchen, toilet and cow shed have all been destroyed. I can see life is going to be very hard for me, but I’ve no other option other than living here. 10.27.19 Music 10.27.27 Narrator But Theophile has at least been welcomed back. His friends in the village believe that he was a victim of circumstance. 10.27.33 Music 10.27.38 Narrator He knows that when the Gacaca Court begins and he has to face Odette, he will have a sympathetic audience. 10.27.44 Music 10.27.49 Villager 1 Voice over I heard Theophile was forced to kill by some soldiers; he didn’t want to do it. 10.27.57 Villager 2 Voice over He was a very nice man; even Odette can tell you that. But things have changed, because she married someone else. I’m telling you the truth. 10.28.15 Villager 3 Voice over I wouldn’t blame him if I was his wife. In my opinion Biseruka did nothing wrong, he was protecting his wife and kids and his own life. 10.28.29 Narrator On the day of the killings Odette survived by running from the house taking Kofi and Sharif with her. 10.28.39 Odette Voice over I’m going to show you where I was hiding. This plant was bigger then and had big leaves and roots. They’ve been cut now. I was crouching here. There was lots of sogum in front of me and no one could see me. I came down here and hid until evening. 10.29.17 Narrator After the killings Theophile found Odette and took her and the boys home, with nowhere else to go she stayed with him until he was arrested. 10.29.33 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I will live here alone. I never think of marrying another woman. 10.29.46 Music 10.29.55 Odette Voice over My wedding to John was not like the first one. With Theophile we didn’t go to church, we had a registry office wedding. We didn’t invite many people, we kept it simple. 10.30.19 Narrator But Odette knew she was committing a crime. By marrying John without getting a divorce from Theophile, she became a bigamist. 10.30.36 Odette Voice over I loved John and so I did everything I could to be with him. I had Theophile’s name removed from my documents. I got a certificate saying I was single and got married. Whatever happens now I’m prepared for Theophile to take me to court. I knew I’d never go back to him. 10.31.08 Narrator Now Theophile believes that with good legal advice there might be a way to get back at Odette. 10.31.18 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles I want all my belongings and my family back. The thing with my wife… 10.31.27 Lawyer Subtitles What do you mean by all your belongings? What specifically is it that you want? 10.31.33 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles My property. My children… and my wife. 10.31.37 Lawyer Subtitle Your wife? 10.31.39 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitle I’ve never stopped loving her. 10.31.41 Lawyer Subtitles In a court of law, the second marriage is void… on the basis that the first one is still valid. Nobody has the right to take your wife… if the first marriage is still valid. 10.31.58 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitle Thank you. 10.32.00 Music 10.32.13 Odette Voice over Before the genocide I loved him very much. If he hadn’t killed my family maybe we would still be together because I loved him when I married him. 10.32.23 Music 10.32.51 Narrator Six months have passed since Theophile left prison. He still hasn’t seen Odette but every day he passes the place where he killed her family. 10.33.08 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over They lined up the young girls very close together in front of my mother-in-law. The old lady took her sarong and wrapped it round the two girls like this. She said to me; ‘my child, do as you’re told, you done everything you could’. 10.33.36 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over Whenever I come here I remember everything. Before I was arrested I used to come in the evenings and pray. 10.34.02 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over Remembering all this makes me very sad. 10.34.21 Music 10.34.26 Narrator Odette’s family and nearly two thousand Tutsi were slaughtered in this valley in nineteen ninety-four. Many of the killers blame the devil for having entered their hearts. 10.34.36 Music/singing 10.35.33 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I knew that killing was a sin. I seek forgiveness from God all the time. Those who killed should ask to be forgiven. And those who lost their loved ones should forgive, that’s the only way forward. 10.36.09 Interviewer The story that Theophile tells us again and again is that he was forced to kill Odette’s family; had he not killed them he would have been killed. Do you believe that? 10.36.22 John Voice over Theophile was a ringleader in the area. He had the gun; who could have forced him to kill? Even Odette would have been killed like the others if she hadn’t been hiding, so he couldn’t find her to kill her. 10.36.45 Odette Voice over He asked our neighbour where I was. She just said she saw me run out the back of the house. If they had found me, they would have killed me. 10.37.02 John Voice over He would have done it himself. 10.37.03 Odette Voice over Yes. 10.37.13 John Voice over It was in his power to let them live. He didn’t just kill them to save his own life. Someone offered to kill them for him in exchange for his banana beer. But Theophile refused. He preferred to keep the beer and to kill them himself. 10.37.43 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over That’s a lie. It’s the first time I’ve heard this. I think she made up the story to convince people that I’m evil. Why would I kill her family but not kill her too? What she says is just lies. She’s just trying to cover up her own mistakes and make me look evil. She loved another man and got married. 10.38.23 Music 10.38.26 Narrator Theophile believes he has the law on his side and has served Odette with a writ for bigamy. 10.38.32 Music 10.38.37 John Subtitles If he takes you to court… you’ll have to admit you’ve done wrong because you married twice. There are laws that will punish you. 10.38.50 Odette Subtitle Why? 10.38.51 John Subtitles There are laws against bigamy. I won’t be in trouble… I didn’t have anything to do with it. Your ID showed you were single. If they punish you, what will you do? 10.39.05 Odette Subtitles I’ll say he killed my family. I can’t live with someone I hate. 10.39.21 John Subtitle We better get ready for battle. 10.39.27 Music 10.39.38 Narrator Theophile has left his old house and now lives just minutes away from Odette and John in the capital, Kigali. 10.39.45 Music 10.39.51 John Voice over Theophile has moved from Shyorongy and now lives on that hill over there. He’s upset because I treat his wife better than he used to. And he knows he’s never going to get her back. 10.40.02 Music 10.40.08 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over He has betrayed me. We’ll never be friends again. 10.40.15 Narrator Life in the city is not as easy as Theophile expected. He’s been turned down for a job as a security guard and his hopes of getting his children back have yet to materialise. 10.40.28 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I would like them to live with me but not at the moment. It’s a problem now because I don’t have any work. But when I can support myself the first thing I’ll do is get the children back. 10.40.55 Narrator The bigamy case against Odette is imminent and Kofi and Sharif are caught up in their parents’ battle. 10.41.07 Sharif Voice over I heard my Mum saying that she’s going to court because Dad has filed a case against her. 10.41.19 Kofi Voice over Dad would like to take us home with him but we don’t want to go. 10.41.29 Sharif Voice over Then Mummy said we’ll go there very soon. That he’ll come and collect us after the court case. 10.41.43 Kofi Voice over When we meet Dad he asks us whether we’d prefer to go to his house or stay with Mum. I just keep quiet. 10.41.59 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles Do you know what missing someone means? 10.42.04 Sharif Subtitles It’s when you don’t see someone for a long time. 10.42.11 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitle Did you miss me then? Sharif Subtitle Yes. 10.42.14 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles What about you? Did you miss me too? 10.42.28 Sharif Subtitle Mummy told us to hate you. 10.42.31 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitle To hate me? 10.42.32 Sharif Subtitle Yes, because of what you’ve done to her. 10.42.35 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitle Just ignore her. 10.42.50 Narrator Odette’s future looks bleak. If she’s convicted of bigamy she could face up to three years in prison 10.42.59 Odette Subtitles Sharif, I’m teaching you to cook… so you won’t have any problems if you live with your father. 10.43.13 Sharif Subtitle Ok. 10.43.20 Odette Voice over He wants to take them but I don’t think they want to go. I wish I could keep my children but the law says I have to give them to him. I will suffer but that’s the way it has to be. 10.43.37 Music 10.43.53 Narrator Theophile’s day in court has arrived. He’s confident he’s got a strong case against his wife. 10.44.00 Narrator This is the first time since his release that Theophile sees Odette with her new husband. 10.44.05 Music 10.44.13 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I don’t feel anything at all. I just have to accept it. I was once like that with her; tomorrow it may be someone else. So I don’t care. Before it used to hurt me but now I’ve got over it. 10.44.40 Odette Voice over He used to be good looking but he’s different now. Maybe it’s the blood on his hands. 10.44.47 Music 10.45.00 Narrator Theophile has decided to represent himself. And there is some confusion as to what charges he’s pressing. 10.45.09 Judge Subtitles Ntaganda? You have not established your accusation to the court. The lawyer needs to know the reason he’s coming to court. That’s why you have to put the details of your accusation in writing… so the lawyer can have a look at it. 10.45.31 Lawyer Subtitles If he doesn’t have the money for a lawyer… the Law Society can provide him with one. 10.45.38 Theophile Subtitles I don’t need a lawyer, I’ll do it myself. 10.45.41 Narrator Odette’s lawyer has a strategy. The bigamy case can’t proceed, he argues, until the court has considered Odette’s attempt to divorce Theophile six years earlier. 10.45.52 Lawyer Subtitles The previous case was a divorce petition. 10.45.59 Judge Subtitle Ntaganda, what do you say about that? 10.46.05 Theophile Ntaganda Subtitles I think we should carry on, as we’re both here. As far as I’m concerned, the divorce petition… has been concluded. Whoever has won has won… whoever has lost has lost. I don’t think there should be an excuse. We should go ahead and deal with the case which is in front of us now. 10.46.35 Judge Subtitle The case is adjourned. 10.46.42 Narrator An adjournment was not the outcome that Theophile was hoping for. 10.46.52 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I’m not happy. I came here prepared for the trial but I have to respect the law. 10.47.02 Odette Voice over I’m very happy. I wasn’t properly prepared for the trial. 10.47.14 John Voice over I just want the trial to be over so we can all get on with our lives. 10.47.24 Theophile Ntaganda Voice over I don’t want her anymore. She made it clear she detests me. She didn’t even say hello; although John did. 10.47.40 Odette Voice over I can only say that he looks old now. I don’t feel he was ever my husband; he’s my enemy. 10.47.53 Music 10.48.00 Narrator Odette is optimistic about her future. Her lawyer is pushing for the court to reconsider her divorce from Theophile. The bigamy trial has been postponed. And she still has the children. 10.48.13 Music 10.48.26 Interviewer Do you still love Theophile? 10.48.30 Sharif Voice over No, I don’t love him. 10.48.36 Kofi Voice over I don’t love him because of the bad things he did to our Mum. He hasn’t even looked after me since I was a baby. That’s why I love Mum and John because they’ve raised me. So they are the ones I will help when I finish school. 10.49.01 Narrator A year after his release, Theophile’s prospects seem uncertain. He still faces meeting Odette at the Gacaca Court where he must ask for her forgiveness. His future, like that of thousands of killers, is on hold as Rwanda struggles to come to terms with life after genocide. 10.49.20 End music 10.49.38 Voice over Have your say on tonight’s show and explore a world of extra information, news stories and features by visiting our web site at: www.bbc.co.uk/thisworld Credits 10.49.34 Narrator NATASCHA McELHONE Colourist KATHERINE GRINCELL Composer GABRIEL CHWOJNIK Dubbing Mixer MATT SKILTON Camera DANIELA VÖLKER Aerial Photography ADRIAN WARREN VT Editor BOYD NAGLE Production Team JULIA DANNENBERG SARAH EVA MARTHA O’SULLIVAN AGNES TEEK Production Manager JANE WILLEY Unit Manager SUSAN CRIGHTON Film Research NICK DODD Research MANU KABAHIZI OLLY BOOTLE BABU EMILE Film Editor JULES CORNELL Deputy Editor DAVID BELTON Produced and Directed by DANIELA VÖLKER 10.49.57 thisworld Editor KAREN O’CONNOR BBC © BBC MMIV 10.50.00 End BBC This World 1 1