Correspondent: Holidays in the Axis of Evil ? Syria ? Iran ? Libya Tx Date: 17th February 2003 This script was made from audio tape – any inaccuracies are due to voices being unclear or inaudible 00.00.00 George W Bush Axis of Evil! Axis of Evil! Axis of Evil! 00.00.04 Ben Anderson A year ago George W Bush branded six countries as the world’s most evil. 00.00.09 Music 00.00.11 Ben Anderson I wanted to explore the enemy territory. 00.00.14 Music 00.00.19 Ben Anderson So I took a holiday through the Axis of Evil. 00.00.22 Music 00.00.27 Title Page holidays in the AXIS OF EVIL 00.00.31 SYRIA 00.00.35 Music 00.00.39 Ben Anderson Syria was added to the Axis of Evil list in March for possessing chemical and biological weapons. It is also accused of developing a ballistic missile programme with the help of Russia and North Korea. 00.00.50 Music 00.00.54 Ben Anderson Travelling on a tourist visa with my producer Will, I arrived in Damascus, a modern city open to the outside world. 00.01.00 Music 00.01.05 Ben Anderson Although maybe a few too many portraits of the President and his late father. 00.01.08 Music 00.01.13 Ben Anderson But it’s other portraits that highlight just how far apart America and the Middle East are. Hamas, Hezbollah and Islamic Jihad are branded terrorist groups in the West for their attacks on Israel. Here, they are celebrated as heroes. 00.01.27 Ben Anderson I was shown round the old city by a local guide, Nassim, who wouldn’t talk about Syrian politics but when I mentioned Israel. 00.01.35 Nassim We have about half a million Palestinians in Damascus. Many of them they still have the keys of their houses, which they lost. And so this unjust, unjustice, that the West have been dealing the Arabs or the Muslims regarding the cause of Palestine, of course this will drive the people to continue fighting to, to get back their lands. 00.02.01 Music 00.02.03 Ben Anderson Hostility towards Israel is everywhere in Syria. But one poster stood out. The meat in an American hamburger is a four month old Palestinian, killed when Israeli tanks shelled a refugee camp in Gaza after a Palestinian terrorist attack on a Jewish settlement. 00.02.20 Woman Boycott American goods. 00.02.22 Music 00.02.24 Nassim Boycott… 00.02.26 Ben Anderson … US goods. 00.02.30 Ben Anderson Over three hundred Palestinian children have been killed during the current Intifada and America gives Israel at least five billion dollars a year in aid. Syria, along with most other Arab states, has imposed a boycott on all American goods. 00.02.44 Nassim Every, every US dollar that we buy that goes to the, or a percentage of which goes to the Israelis to help the Israelis that buy American weapons and kill the Palestinians. This is the truth. 00.03.01 Ben Anderson The local restaurant we were taken to was sticking to the boycott. Arabic producers of imitation products are struggling to meet demand. 00.03.09 Ben Anderson Tastes the same. 00.03.10 Will If there was no embargo, which American goods would you like? 00.03.15 Nassim I don’t think there is any American product I want to get here. 00.03.21 Will McDonalds? No? 00.03.25 Woman No. 00.03.26 Will You know the Axis of Evil? 00.03.27 Nassim Yeah. 00.03.28 Will Libya, North Korea, Iran, Iraq and then they added Syria? How do people feel about that? 00.03.35 Nassim Very angry. 00.03.38 Music 00.03.39 Ben Anderson Officially Syria has recognised the State of Israel although many maps in Syria don’t even acknowledge its existence. 00.03.45 Music 00.03.47 Ben Anderson I had expected everyone to be calling for the death of Israel. Instead, everyone I met said they would live peacefully alongside Israel if only it would return the land conquered in the 1967 war. 00.03.59 Man They have to stop the war in Palestine not to make more war. That’s what we have, we have to ask. 00.04.06 Ben Anderson How can you stop it? 00.04.07 Man To get justice for the people. 00.04.09 Ben Anderson Back to the 1967 borders? 00.04.11 Man Of course, at least. 00.04.12 Ben Anderson At least? 00.04.13 Man Of course. 00.04.17 Ben Anderson Reminders of Syria’s political dynasty loom large in the country. Hafez Assad ruled the country for thirty years and when he died two years ago his English- educated son Bashir took over. 00.04.29 Woman Why what, why do we have a lot of pictures? It’s just people loving them so they just put pictures everywhere. It’s a kind of expression that you love someone so you just hold his or her photos all the time with you. 00.04.45 Will In England we don’t have that. 00.04.47 Woman Well I know it is a custom here or something like that, just expressing that you love the man. 00.04.54 Music 00.04.56 Ben Anderson Despite encouraging early signs, Bashir soon proved to be either unwilling or unable to change the regime, which he had inherited from his father. After releasing scores of political prisoners the old pattern of executions, torture and disappearances now continues. 00.05.13 Ben Anderson Syria may support Islamist movements, which challenge the common enemy abroad, it’s not so kind to them when they challenge things at home. Twenty years ago Assad Senior wiped out six thousand members of the Islamic group, the Muslim Brotherhood. 00.05.27 Aston BEN ANDERSON Nothing is more dangerous to Islam than distorting its meaning and concepts while posing as a Muslim. They are killing in the name of Islam, they are assassinating in the name of Islam. They are butchering children, women and old people in the name of Islam. They are wiping out entire families in the name of Islam. That’s, that’s not George Bush or Dick Cheney speaking, that’s President Hafez Al-Assad twenty years ago when he wiped out six thousand, well roughly six thousand men, women and children in the town of Hammah which had been taken over by the Muslim Brotherhood for four days. And they will proudly say… 00.06.00 Door bell 00.06.11 Ben Anderson But the rallying power of moderate Islam is strong in this secular state. Friday afternoon prayers and a trip to Damascus’s main mosque to hear the Grand Mufti’s weekly sermon. 00.06.21 Singing 00.06.26 Nassim Ten minutes? 00.06.27 Will Ten, fifteen minutes. 00.06.28 Nassim Fifteen minutes. 00.06.29 Singing 00.06.37 Ben Anderson The ninety-four year old cleric is Syria’s most influential religious figure. His sermons are as political as they are spiritual. 00.06.45 Ben Anderson Fifteen minutes stretched to two hours when Will, the producer, was mistaken as one of a party of visiting Danish schoolteachers and invited to take a ringside seat. 00.06.57 Ben Anderson I sat up in the translation booth whilst the old man questioned the West’s version of September the eleventh. 00.07.05 Translator Up till now no one has been able to prove who was the doer. Why is this malice against Islam? 00.07.22 Ben Anderson He said, first of all he said military power, then chemical weapons and even nuclear weapons, anyone possessing these things will be held accountable. Anybody. There was no death to America, no death to Israel. And he said he would like to say to George Bush what would Jesus Christ have said to you if you told him about the idea of pre-emptive strikes? 00.07.47 Ben Anderson Sticking with the Danish schoolteachers, we went backstage to meet the Grand Mufti. As the women covered up, I become conscious of my bare knees. 00.07.55 Ben Anderson I just had no idea we’d be having an audience with the Grand Mufti. 00.07.59 Music 00.08.03 Ben Anderson The Grand Mufti finally arrived suffering from cramp but the expected question and answer session never materialised. His doctor has advised him to slow down. 00.08.12 Man It’s ok to… 00.08.13 Ben Anderson Film with the camera? 00.08.17 Ben Anderson I did get a quick meeting with his son. 00.08.20 Son From England? 00.08.20 Ben Anderson Yeah. 00.08.24 Man translating son I visited Britain four times. And I stayed in Leeds for two months. 00.08.30 Ben Anderson Leeds? 00.08.30 Son Yes. 00.08.31 Ben Anderson I’ve been to Leeds. 00.08.33 Ben Anderson He also supported a return to Israel’s ‘67 borders and said that Muslims, Christians and Jews were stronger when they were working together. 00.08.43 Man translating Son And we are also praying for those who are extremists in Islam to be guided. Because extremism is a disease in every religion. 00.08.54 Ben Anderson Thank you very much. 00.08.58 Singing 00.09.00 Ben Anderson Syria was quick to distance itself from Islamic extremism after September the eleventh but Nassim told me they still felt tarred with the same brush. 00.09.09 Nassim There has been very bad propaganda describing the Arab character with a very bad description. Hollywood played a very big role in this and is still playing a lot of films, destroyed the image of the Arab in the West and of course all the West have this background, them came Bin Laden. 00.09.31 Music 00.09.35 Ben Anderson But Bin Laden is not the enemy of Syria, Israel is. The next day we left Damascus to visit the Golan Heights, the Syrian land captured by Israel in the 1967 war. 00.09.45 Music 00.09.50 Will What’s going on? 00.09.55 Ben Anderson Well our guide and driver couldn’t get permission to go to Quneitra, the Golan Heights border. So we’ve gone to the bus station and hired a little mini-bus for ourselves for the day. He doesn’t speak English, so. I don’t think our problems are over yet. 00.10.15 Music 00.10.16 Ben Anderson Once a town of thirty three thousand people, Quneitra was lost in the 1967 war. Under a disengagement agreement in 1974, Israel agreed to hand Quneitra back but not before using bulldozers and dynamite to totally devastate the town. 00.10.32 Ben Anderson President Assad decided not to rebuild it. 00.10.35 Ben Anderson The radio stations at the top of the mountain, that’s Israel. 00.10.40 Ben Anderson But leave it as a monument to Israeli brutality. 00.10.43 Ben Anderson As soon as you see the plush fields, that’s the occupied territory, Golan Heights. And these are all houses, which on the way here we were told were bulldozed and actually the roofs are intact but collapsed on top of the, on top of the houses so it does look like they were bulldozed rather than bombed. 00.11.02 Ben Anderson As we wandered round in the midday sun, it became clear that our bus driver had deserted us. 00.11.13 Ben Anderson So we’re in the village of Sumdenia, hitchhiking our way back to Damascus because our bus driver deserted us outside Kinetra. 00.11.25 Will And this music? 00.11.27 Ben Anderson What’s his name? 00.11.29 Man Hatim Malarqi. 00.11.30 Ben Anderson Hatim Malarqi, he’s an Iraqi singer. Very famous? 00.11.36 Man This Iraq. 00.11.38 Ben Anderson You know Robbie Williams? Robbie Williams? 00.11.41 Man Robbie Williams? 00.11.42 Ben Anderson Robbie Williams or Michael Jackson? 00.11.43 Man No, no, no, no. 00.11.45 Ben Anderson No. Arabic. But he is… 00.11.49 Man I, I, I, I love Michael Jackson, Michael Jackson’s History, cassette, Michael Jackson’s History. 00.11.57 Ben Anderson But he is very big in Iraq? 00.12.00 Man Yes. 00.12.01 Ben Anderson He’s a star. 00.12.02 Man Star. 00.12.04 Ben Anderson Unlike North Korea, Syria has satellite dishes everywhere giving locals access to CNN and BBC. But it’s state-owned Syrian TV that seemed more in tune with current Syrian thinking. 00.12.16 Newsreader 1 A new gruesome atrocity was added today to the Israeli criminal record when the occupation troops attacked Raffa, killing eight and wounding more than fifty-five, ten of them seriously. 00.12.28 Newsreader 2 Israeli forces of occupation perpetrated today a new massacre against the Palestinian people but Syrian sources say that at least eight Palestinians were killed including the…. 00.12.33 Telephone rings 00.12.39 Ben Anderson Hello! Yeah, hey, how are you doing? It’s Liz. 00.12.44 Ben Anderson An unexpected call from Elizabeth, the other producer working on the series. We had been told that we would have to cancel our Iran trip because the war in Iraq would start in October. But for the time being, those plans had been shelved. If we were going to Iran, we first had to complete a chemical weapons course. 00.13.00 Ben Anderson So we do the chemical and biological weapons training course on Thursday and Friday. Cheers Liz, bye. 00.13.07 Music 00.13.10 Ben Anderson Just two days into our trip we were brought home. 00.13.13 Music 00.13.14 Training course 00.13.52 George W Bush Axis of Evil! Axis of Evil! Axis of Evil! 00.13.54 Title Page holidays in the AXIS OF EVIL 00.13.59 IRAN 00.14.07 Ben Anderson Iran is on the Axis of Evil A-list; accused of supporting and supplying terrorist groups as well as producing biological weapons. We spent ten days there but seven of those were in the custody of the Religious Police, who accused us of spying. 00.14.25 Music 00.14.28 Ben Anderson After three days of talking to people who were too afraid to say anything, we were arrested in Tehran. Our hotel rooms were searched, our tourist visas found, our tapes taken and seven days of interrogation began. 00.14.40 Music 00.14.44 Ben Anderson They did a kind of good cop, bad cop thing but the good cop kind of disappeared after about twenty minutes and the bad cop who was this big hairy guy with a beard. 00.14.51 Ben Anderson And every time I wrote out an answer they weren’t happy with that wasn’t saying what he told me to say, which was you want to prove we sponsor Al Qaeda, the guy with the beard would, would kind of raise an elbow right in front of my face or he’d stand up and clench his fist as if he was going to start swinging punches or he’d hit my back or slap me a few times. 00.15.10 Elizabeth It was kind of the relentless nature of the questions I think that was scary and the way they asked them and the fact that they were threatening you know execution. 00.15.21 Music 00.15.23 Ben Anderson We were interrogated and threatened for hours every night. They were certain our real mission was to prove links between Iran and Al Qaeda and provide information to British intelligence. They weren’t happy with our more modest confessions but eventually let us go. We didn’t have a film but we had learnt a great deal about life in Iran. 00.15.42 Music 00.15.50 Ben Anderson You see a lot of graffiti in Iran. Some stuff is ‘down with USA’, ‘down with Israel’. But some of it says ‘Eminem’ or what I saw two or three times were ‘Yahoo.com’ and e-mail, you know that’s the way to talk to Iranians is via e-mail. They talk, they talk openly. Before I went I used to spend hours a day chatting to Iranians and they would, they would say how much they hate the regime, how much they wanted them to be gone. 00.16.14 Elizabeth But that is the strange thing about the place though isn’t it? You know, in some ways it’s so open, so totally on- line you know, so web-savvy and yet you know there is this other side to it, which is scary and kind of from the dark ages. 00.16.27 Music 00.16.30 Ben Anderson The country has an elected reformist President Khatami but the real power lies with Ayatollah Khomeini’s old guard. They are not elected but have control of the police, the military and the law courts. 00.16.41 Music 00.16.46 Will And how repressive is it in Iran? 00.16.50 Elizabeth Well I think our experience shows there’s a reason people are terrified and, and we were probably treated rather well by comparison with, with other people. I think it’s, you know, it’s a scary place, very repressive. 00.17.06 Ben Anderson We spoke to one family and they said their daughter had been lashed fifty times I think for being at an illegal party and we saw a tape of one of these parties and it’s like a fifteen year old school disco, isn’t it? Kind of people shyly standing around not really wanting to dance properly and this was, you know, this was a brave act for them. This was a brave thing for them to do because if the religious police turn up they’ll just beat everyone up and arrest them. 00.17.28 Music 00.17.32 Ben Anderson But many Iranians are fighting the conservative powers. Demonstrations are regularly held and were recently stepped up after a reformist cleric was sentenced to death for daring to suggest that clerical rule should not be blindly followed. 00.17.47 Elizabeth I feel sort of sad about the experience in that I think what, you know, what we’ve come away with is an experience which sort of is exactly the opposite of the Iran we would have liked to have portrayed. 00.17.59 Ben Anderson In some ways it’s similar to Iraq. You know when George Bush talks about Iraq; he’s talking about one man and a small group of people around him. Same thing in Iran. You’re talking about one very small group; you’re not talking about a country. You’re talking about a tiny group that most of the people in that country would love to see gone. 00.18.15 George W Bush Axis of Evil! Axis of Evil! Axis of Evil! 00.18.17 Title Page holidays in the AXIS OF EVIL 00.18.22 LIBYA 00.18.26 Music 00.18.29 Ben Anderson Two weeks later and I was off to Libya, another Islamic state with a habit of imprisoning and executing critical voices. 00.18.36 Ben Anderson Gaddafi has been on the hit list for decades for involvement in terrorism in Europe. 00.18.42 Ben Anderson Last March Libya was added to the Axis of Evil list, accused of pursuing nuclear weapons and producing at least a hundred tonnes of chemical weapons. 00.18.52 Ben Anderson But Libya is desperate to come in from the cold. They handed over the Lockerbie suspects as a condition for ending US imposed sanctions. Libya is now welcoming the tourist dollar. But they still have much to learn. 00.19.06 Ben Anderson This hotel is the, one of the two best hotels in Libya. Its main selling point is its view over the lake. Absolutely honks! Because I think sewage is poured into the lake and it stinks. So it would be a nice view if you didn’t gag every time you looked at it. 00.19.31 Music 00.19.40 Ben Anderson Our first night out in Tripoli with our twenty-six year old guide, Ali. Most of the tourists he shows round tend to be elderly groups of archaeology enthusiasts who come to visit Libya’s numerous Greek and Roman ruins. So he has little opportunity to play them songs from his friend’s band. 00.19.57 Music 00.20.10 Ali I really like this song, really. 00.20.12 Will Tell me what that song was. 00.20.13 Ali It’s called Mountain of Regret. It was some, some Libyan who used to live here and he made it here because he regrets coming back from England to here. 00.20.23 Will He came back from England to Libya? 00.20.24 Ali Yeah. 00.20.24 Will And regrets it? 00.20.25 Ali Oh yeah. And now he’s back there to England so, he lost the spirit of this music. 00.20.33 Music 00.20.55 Ben Anderson Of the six countries I visited, Libya was the least political. People here are resigned to the fact that there is nothing they can do about Gaddafi or America. So instead they watch European football or pirated Western films. 00.21.09 Ben Anderson This is as good as it gets on Saturday night in Libya. 00.21.12 Music 00.21.20 Will What about The American President, do people watch that? 00.21.23 Man 1 We like the action movies, the American movies. 00.21.27 Man 2 We don’t watch much English films. 00.21.30 Ben Anderson You don’t like it. 00.21.32 Ben Anderson Ali’s friends were more interested in watching the Italian football. Gaddafi’s son and heir apparent, Zadi, owns seven and a half percent of Juventus. As a result they’re the most unpopular Italian team in Libya. Gaddafi’s son is also President of Libya’s Football Association and the team’s first choice centre-forward. 00.21.51 Will Libya as a football team now, they’re starting again. Ten years time, do you think they’ll be good? 00.21.58 Ali No comment. 00.21.59 Man 2 No comment. Political question. 00.22.04 Will It’s a football question. 00.22.05 Man 2 Everything is related to politics here. 00.22.12 Ali There’s no sex channels; you mean that’s the thing. 00.22.15 Ben Anderson There is sex channels but you’re not allowed to see the organ. 00.22.17 Ali Any sex channel, you cannot find the organ. 00.22.20 Ben Anderson No, no, no organ. 00.22.24 Man 2 How come? Disappointing. 00.22.26 Will It’s an English thing. In Europe and in America you can show penetration. You cannot show penetration in England. It’s changing very slowly, so I’m told. 00.22.34 Ali I’m reconsidering. 00.22.37 Ben Anderson He’s very disappointed in England. 00.22.39 Will But you can get it here, porn channels? 00.22.41 Ali Oh yeah. Football, you don’t watch football. You don’t have, how come you live in England? How can you live there? 00.22.48 Ben Anderson We’re very oppressed. 00.22.49 Ali I mean every, bah! Really! 00.22.54 Music 00.22.58 Ben Anderson Many people we met in Libya were very critical of Gaddafi but were scared of saying anything near the camera. Some common themes were emerging. 00.23.07 Ben Anderson In the bookshop round the corner there was no hint of criticism, only books praising the man. 00.23.12 Music 00.23.21 Ali Even Chinese or Japanese and this is in Hebrew, yeah, Hebrew. 00.23.30 Ben Anderson Does that one sell a lot? 00.23.34 Will I never thought I’d see the Green Book in Hebrew. Shall we get the Libyan proverbs there? 00.23.40 Ali Oh yeah, Libyan proverbs. 00.23.44 Will Any good ones? 00.23.46 Ben Anderson Never find your delight in another’s misfortune. Barking dogs do not bite. Better to be one day cock than to be ten days hen. 00.23.57 Ali Oh yeah. 00.23.59 Will Do we agree with that? 00.24.00 Ali Oh yeah. 00.24.01 Music 00.24.01 Graphic A book is the best of friends Libyan Proverbs 00.24.06 Ben Anderson This is, this is the bible for life. It’s taught in schools apparently. The Thinker, Muammar Gaddafi does not present his thought for simple amusement or pleasure. Oh dear! Here it is. Not amusing at all. 00.24.20 Music 00.24.22 Ben Anderson The book contains his theories on economics, race, religion, man and woman, although his actual theory was often hard to find. 00.24.31 Ben Anderson Woman. It is an undisputed fact that both man and woman are human beings. Woman loves and hates as man loves and hates. Woman feels hunger and thirst as man feels hunger and thirst. Human society is composed neither of man alone nor of woman alone. Why were not only men created? Why were not only women created? Woman is a female and man is a male. 00.24.52 Music 00.24.53 Ben Anderson Women are supposed to be liberated under Gaddafi, although on the streets they’re rarely seen. 00.24.58 Music 00.25.01 Ben Anderson Our visit coincided with the month of Ramadan where Muslims who make up ninety-seven percent of Libya’s population can’t eat during daylight hours. Ali persuaded us to join him for a day, which starts with a pre-dawn breakfast. 00.25.13 Ben Anderson What time is it? Five? 00.25.16 Ali To five. 00.25.17 Will Sorry. 00.25.18 Ali It’s five to five. Just have a seat. 00.25.23 Music 00.25.27 Ali Shalom! After you’ve finished the meal you have to fill up your stomach with water. That’s what we do until it’s like, you cannot add anymore and then that’s fine. That’s enough for the day. 00.25.39 Music 00.25.58 Ben Anderson It’s going to be sunrise soon. And you can hear all the first prayers of the day start, which means we can’t swallow anything until sunset, which is about thirteen hours away. 00.26.15 Will How are you feeling? 00.26.17 Ben Anderson I feel hungry already. 00.26.18 Music 00.26.23 Graphic Fill the belly and the eye will get ashamed Libyan Proverbs 00.26.32 Ben Anderson Colonel Gaddafi seized power in 1969 following a bloodless coup. The revolution was socialist rather than Islamic. But ideology aside, the result is the same. Gaddafi has total control over the nation’s six million residents. Gaddafi memorabilia takes pride of place at Tripoli’s History Museum. 00.26.52 Ali It was his private car. 00.26.54 Ben Anderson When he was twenty-seven that was his car? 00.26.56 Ali Yeah. Gaddafi. 00.26.59 Ben Anderson He was a hippie. 00.27.01 Music 00.27.07 Ben Anderson Visitors to the museum can enjoy the Greek and Roman artefacts unearthed over the last century. But one historical figure looms largest. 00.27.15 Music 00.27.20 Ali This is Colonel Gaddafi, twenty-seven and I’m twenty- six. 00.27.24 Music 00.27.30 Ben Anderson Is that Nasser? 00.27.31 Ali Yeah, General Nasser. 00.27.33 Ben Anderson And that’s, that’s when they were trying to unify Libya, Syria and Egypt altogether? 00.27.37 Ali Yes. Oh yeah. The plan was to have the Arab unity and it didn’t work as usual and as always so we just turned to the Africans because Africans really supported Libya during the sanctions. 00.27.54 Music 00.27.56 Ben Anderson During the tour in the museum I was hanging back for a little while and the guy came up and said don’t believe everything you read and there was a whole room dedicated to declarations of devotion from Libyan people and surrounding countries, even India. And he said we have an Arabic word for this. It’s arse-kissing. 00.28.15 Music 00.28.15 Graphic Who dares to tell the Lion he has bad breath? Libyan Proverbs 00.28.24 Ben Anderson Following Gaddafi’s failure to unite the Arab world he turned his hand to African unity and traded them oil for help busting sanctions. Nelson Mandela was one of the many African leaders who visited Libya during the embargo. 00.28.37 Ben Anderson But Gaddafi’s vision was not shared by all Libyans and two years ago thousands of sub-Saharan Africans living in Libya were attacked, with dozens killed by Libyans claiming their jobs were being taken from them. 00.28.50 Ben Anderson After Gaddafi handed over the Lockerbie suspects and sanctions were lifted, oil production, which accounts for ninety-five percent of Libya’s foreign earnings has started to rise again. But despite revenues of eleven billion dollars last year one in three Libyans is unemployed and the once grand city finds its colonial architecture crumbling. 00.29.09 Music 00.29.18 Ben Anderson Libya was colonised by the Italians in 1911 and it was only liberated at the end of the Second World War when various nationalities, including Libyans, fought and died during the El Alamein campaign. 00.29.30 Ben Anderson Next door to the cemetery is a mosque looked after by former stoker, second-class, Beglusum Buklal, a Libyan who fought alongside the British. 00.29.44 Will English army? 00.29.44 Beglusum Buklal Yeah, great. 00.29.47 Ben Anderson Ability good, conduct good. 00.29.51 Will So you were in the English army? 00.29.52 Beglusum Buklal Yeah. 00.29.53 Will In Libya? 00.29.54 Beglusum Buklal Yeah, I remember before after, I come in ’43, Winston Churchill… General Montgomery. 00.30.08 Music 00.30.13 Ben Anderson In 1952 the British granted Libya independence. 00.30.17 Ben Anderson The British Embassy in Tripoli was abandoned in 1984 following the killing of policewoman Yvonne Fletcher outside the Libyan Embassy in London. 00.30.26 Ben Anderson The building is now a library, which houses an eclectic collection of books. 00.30.30 Music 00.30.35 Ben Anderson Kim Il Sung! 00.30.36 Music 00.30.41 Ben Anderson Only one stamp on the Great Leader’s book and a stain that would be unthinkable in Pyong Yang. 00.30.49 Ben Anderson You’d get locked up for allowing that to happen. 00.30.50 Music 00.30.52 Ben Anderson A far more popular book was this guide to defence systems around the world, which fell open on one particular country. The other well-thumbed book was the International Who’s Who with its list of offices held by the humble colonel. 00.31.05 Music 00.31.10 Ben Anderson Libyan army officer and political leader. Chief-in- Command of Armed Forces, Prime Minster, Minister of Defence, President of Libya, Member of the Presidential Council, Federation of Arab Republics. Address: Office of the President, Tripoli, Libya. 00.31.27 Music 00.31.34 Ben Anderson During Ramadan the last minutes before breaking the fast are the most dangerous as hungry men drive at break-neck speed to get home to eat. 00.31.44 Ben Anderson As soon as we hear the prayer and get to our guide’s house with his family, we can eat for the first time in thirteen hours. 00.31.52 Will How are you feeling? 00.31.54 Ben Anderson Alright actually. I’m looking forward to the food but haven’t been suffering through lack of food. 00.32.01 Ben Anderson Here we go! 00.32.02 Music 00.32.08 Will They’ve started the call to prayer. Music to my ears. 00.32.16 Ben Anderson The prayers from the mosque signalled the end of the day’s fasting. And even without his friend’s heavy metal, Ali drove at a hundred miles an hour through the streets of Tripoli. 00.32.25 Music 00.32.37 Ali Shall we? 00.32.38 Music 00.32.45 Ben Anderson During dinner and another common theme emerges. I didn’t know the Arabic for poodle. 00.32.52 Ali’s Father We would not expect a British Prime Minister to be servant of the American empire, you know, especially Mr Blair was very young and has children, has young wife and has charisma, something like this. Why he should do that? And America won’t last forever as the sole superpower. 00.33.14 Music 00.33.17 Ben Anderson Evidence of the fleeting nature of superpowers can be found all along Libya’s north coast where some of the best-preserved Greek and Roman ruins can be found. Leptus Magna to the east of Tripoli has a complete Roman town along with amphitheatre. 00.33.31 Music 00.33.35 Guide Here comes the gladiators, fight with each other. 00.33.38 Music 00.33.45 Ben Anderson Fancy your chances? 00.33.48 Ben Anderson But Libya is still considered a rogue state. Only forty thousand foreign visitors came here last year, compared with five million who went to neighbouring Egypt. 00.33.57 Ben Anderson Italians, Brits and Germans are the main visitors. Only a handful of American tourists ignored their government’s advice that Libya is not a safe country to visit. 00.34.09 Will America called Libya one of the axes of evil. 00.34.13 Ali America? It’s not you, you know the truth, you can read more about the truth but Americans always have their terms and they have their expressions in order to… 00.34.23 Ben Anderson It was a surprise. Was that news here, when they added Cuba, Libya and Syria to the list? 00.34.29 Ali Yeah, they made fun, they made fun of that but we, we, we don’t watch Libyan TV really, really. We have the CNN and the cable. We used to have the BBC but because it’s very, very boring for us, they put it, yeah people just complain about it. 00.34.46 Music 00.34.54 Ben Anderson September eleventh, did people here think Bin Laden did it? 00.34.57 Ali Most of the Muslims were glad about the September eleventh and then, when Bush said either with us or with him about Osama Bin Laden, I told him ok, I’ll be with him mother-fucker, that’s what I said in my mind, really. Any Muslim is just like this. You either choose to be against Osama Bin Laden or be against Bush because both are extremists. 00.35.17 Music 00.35.25 Ben Anderson With the rest of Libya fasting I had lunch along with some fellow archaeology tourists. 00.35.33 Ben Anderson So we just saw some bottles of Becks being passed around. A beer in the sun for the first time in four days. But it’s non-alcoholic Becks. 00.35.46 Music 00.35.50 Ben Anderson After lunch we drove up into the Green Mountains. It was here that Omar Mukhtar hid with his fellow Libyan rebels whilst fighting the Italian occupiers eighty years ago. 00.35.59 Ben Anderson With the tree cover and numerous caves, they’ve also provided cover for more recent rebels – a group of Islamic extremists have used the Green Mountains as a base to launch attacks on Gaddafi. 00.36.11 Ben Anderson In 1996 Gaddafi responded by carpet-bombing the area. 00.36.15 Music 00.36.18 Ben Anderson Ali was reluctant to discuss this. Strangely the tourist ministry were also reluctant to let us see Gaddafi’s old house, which was bombed by America in 1986, killing his two year old step-daughter. 00.36.30 Ben Anderson All week we’ve been trying to go to see Gaddafi’s house which was bombed by the Americans in 1986 because of alleged involvement in terrorism against Europe and they’ve been funny about it all week. They’ve been cagey about us going all week and on our last day, we were supposed to be going tomorrow morning before we go to the airport, he’s just said it doesn’t exist anymore. They’ve repaired it and it’s just a city hall now. 00.36.54 Will Why are they reluctant to show us? 00.36.57 Ben Anderson I mean, they do seem reluctant to show us anything, which makes us feel sympathetic towards Gaddafi. 00.37.04 Music 00.37.07 Ben Anderson There were no objections to showing us Libya’s archaeology museum. 00.37.10 Music 00.37.12 Ben Anderson Like the emperor that ruled here two thousand years ago, Gaddafi’s image is everywhere and amongst the ancient artefacts a tiny room devoted to gifts for the colonel from around the world. Some glassware from Palestine and a rather strange letter of support from Iraq. 00.37.29 Ben Anderson Gift to Gaddafi written in blood by an Iraqi traveller. He wrote in blood? In 1992. 00.37.37 Guide Yeah, you can read Arabic? 00.37.40 Ben Anderson No. 00.37.41 Guide How do you know that this is by Iraqi? 00.37.45 Ben Anderson I understand the style. 00.37.47 Ali What style? 00.37.48 Ben Anderson This is an Iraqi style of handwriting, no? 00.37.50 Ali No. 00.37.51 Ben Anderson You can’t tell the difference? 00.37.52 Ali No, this is... 00.37.54 Ben Anderson It says down here. What does it say? 00.37.59 Guide It says… 00.38.00 Ben Anderson Help me I’m dying. Help me I’m dying. 00.38.05 Music 00.39.15 Will I can’t get him all in, hang on. 00.39.17 Music 00.39.23 Will No, I can just about get you. 00.38.25 End music www.bbc.co.uk/bbcfour 00.38.31 Presenter BEN ANDERSON Dubbing Mixer PHITZ HEARNE VT Editor JASPAL BANGA Titles WHY NOT ASSOCIATES Production Team SARAH EVA MARTHA O’SULLIVAN Production Manager JANE WILLEY Unit Manager SUSAN CRIGHTON Film Research NICK DODD Web Producer ANDREW JEFFREY Research BARBARA ARVANITIDIS Picture Editor RYSHARD OPYRCHAL Executive Producers LUCY HETHERINGTON KAREN O’CONNOR 00.38.52 Director/Series Producer WILL DAWS BBC ©BBC MMIII 00.38.58 End BBC Holidays in the Axis of Evil 1 1